The defeatest attitude is at a fever pitch here in the media. I think it's quite disgusting in which the manner of this war has been reported.

The Al Jazeera mentality truly reigns within NBC news and the NY Times.

We're now "numb" towards all the leaks and breaches of ethics. These leakers should truly be ashamed of themselves and are traitors to this country in my view.

L.F.

"These leakers should truly be ashamed of themselves and are traitors to this country in my view."

So, under your analysis Woodward and Bernstein should have been jailed for reporting Watergate? Remember, that story was broken because "Deep Throat" leaked information to them.

"Any attempt Nixon made to fight the war correctly was protested."

And what exactly do you mean by "fight the war correctly"? Please elaborate.

Nixon broke the law... I think there is a subtle difference here that you fail to recognize.

You idiots are under the impression that we need a transparent government/action plan when it comes to dealing with terrorists.

So what if Rumsfeld wrote a memo before he resigned that stated a change of course?
You think David Gregory needs to know everything?

Olbermann is a pussy. He's afraid to debate anyone who opposes his view and he's quite content with having his regular shills on every night.

I tried to watch last night and couldn't. It's easier just to read Johnny Dollar's summary.

PussyKeith should invite Newt on the show. He doesn't have the balls or the brains to debate Newt.

L.F.

Knowingly publishing classified information should be illegal. Why the hell should the American people trust media outlets to correctly decide what should be classified or not. The NY Times has recently said that it was wrong to write a story about a classified issue. Remember Al Jazeera is a "news" organization and has first amendment rights.

NBC News has been the leader in turning up the assault on the administration while assaulting our senses in the process.

From Matt Lauer to Tim Russert. And OlbyPlanet is the extreme.

NBC needs one of those "Howard Dean moments" when the citizen from Iowa stood up and asked Howard Dean why he had to be so nasty? NBC needs that.

I think Brian Williams is an OK guy and so is Brokaw (retired). But they surround themselves with self-serving a--holes who only care about advancing their self-interest at the expense of the country.

Look at Scarborough? What the hell happened to him? Whoring his once conservative credentials.

And Matthews? Cowtowing to Murtha because Matthews was Tip Oneill's boy and Tip gave Murtha a pass on ABSCAM. Matthews by his failure to press Murtha, essentially rewrites history.

And how about lying on the OTHER SIDE OF THE AISLE?? Murtha tells the country that HE HAS THE VOTES for Majority Leader? Only to go down in flames...How's that for public trust?

Disgusting.

L.F.

"PussyKeith should invite Newt on the show."

He can't, because Newt's a "guest host" and contributor for FOX News. As such, Newt is contractually prohibited from appearing on another channel's news programs without permission from FNC.

So why not have on someone, any one with an opinion other than his own? Countdown has degenerated into nothing more than a left-wing echo chamber.

"Nixon broke the law... I think there is a subtle difference here that you fail to recognize."

Um, Woodward and Berstein didn't KNOW Nixon had broken the law. In hindisght, they were right. But AT THE TIME all they had were suspicions, and based upon your logic that wouldn't have been enough.

"He can't, because Newt's a "guest host" and contributor for FOX News."

As a frequent FNC water, I don't recall ever seeing Newt "guest host" anything, only serve as a contributor. However, I've seen a lot of people contribute... both on FNC, MSNBC, and CNN.

Do you have any evidence of their being a contract prohibiting Newt, or is this an assumption?

Let's not mistake Olbermann for some later-day Woodward and Bernstein. His investigative journalism is confined to the sports world, he and his staff merely repeat the talking points from the leftist blogs and websites. They don't even bother to fact-check to see if what they put on air is correct, nor do they bother to post an opinion contrary to their own.

I think FOX would release Newt to debate KO.
It's hard to take you seriously with posts like that.

Monkeymann does remind me of Citizen Kane though....Now, there was a journalist!!

And it still doesn't explain why Olbermann refuses to have anyone on his show who doesn't echo and parrot his own opinions.

"Let's not mistake Olbermann for some later-day Woodward and Bernstein."

I'm not - I was just pointing out the position staked out that "all leakers are traitors" is an absurd proposition.

Nixon really tried to listen to military men such as Admiral McCain(senator McCain's father) but at this point the expansion of the war required to win was too unpopular. Lyndon Johnson faught the war by tying both our hands behind our back. We could have won in months had he listened to the military men and kept politics out of decisions.

We cannot say a good thing about the Vietnam war, and it is sad that Iraq is becoming just as big of a mess. It is even sadder that not all men and women of draft age did not go to Canada. If no one agrees to fight for capitalistic reasons there would not be any wars. Fight War, not wars..., and if forced into the military turn your rifles on those who command you. Death is the best answer for those who support war..

We cannot say a good thing about the Vietnam war, and it is sad that Iraq is becoming just as big of a mess. It is even sadder that not all men and women of draft age did not go to Canada. If no one agrees to fight for capitalistic reasons there would not be any wars. Fight War, not wars..., and if forced into the military turn your rifles on those who command you. Death is the best answer for those who support war..

KO and his friends in the media are borderline tratiors.

From Fallujah-
http://billroggio.com/archives/2006/12/the_military_and_the.php

nice link Charles...

LF,
Your argument about leaking applies to Watergate.

Bush administration apologizers should be careful about calling people cowards.

You whine what happened to Joe Scarborough? How about what happened to Pat Buchanan, the CATO Institute, William Buckley, etc. The Weekly Standard even has an article titled "The Conservative Revolt."

C. Martel,

Bush did permit the "swift boating". He could have easily condemned those ads which would not be supressing free speach as much as disagreeing with what they said. He could have distanced himself from them. Instead all he could do was say all 527 group ads should be stopped knowing this of course would not happen since they are "independent". This is the same guy who let many of these same people that worked on the Swift Boat ads put doubts out about McCain becasue of his experience as a POW in the 2000 primary.

Primary Lesson...Johnson did not lose he relection bid. He didn't even run for president. Due to his fighting a war the people didn't like, his own party fractured and he decided it was better to step aside. Yeah Bush can't run for president again but I think the last election showed the same thing happening in the republican party. members of the aprty were distancing themselves from Bush.

Lesson 2... Nice try Charles. You really misrepresented the point here which wasn't about troop levels. It was about sending troops to help prop up a unstable government. We put 500,000 troops into Vietnam and that did nothing. The government fell. We have far less in Iraq but his point was you can send in more or not but the fact we are propping up an unstable government again and we have been through this before and failed.

You may think we lost the war because we fought with our "hands tied behind our back." I love this point. It is such a cop out and not true. We lost the war because it wasn't our war to fight. We chose to go there(we were not invited by Vietnam but by another country that was occupying the land)) and we chose to get involved in a civil war and we chose a side on that war. Like any great nation before us, we have the ability to lose a war. Yes we used a flawed strategy in Vietnam. Yes we constantly revised the strategy though and it still didn't help us. Yes we won the Tet offensive but that didn't make the people of South Vietnam feel better about us. You know that no nation in history has ever successfully occupied the Vietnam penninsula. You kind of forget about the important historic point when you blame our politicians, military stategy, and media for us losing the war. We should have never even gone there because it wasn't our war. We have a tremendous history of victory in fighting wars that actually involve our direct interests(revolutionary War, War of 1812, French and Indian War, World War I, World War II. We have a horrible track record of getting involved in wars that do not reflect our direct interests(Korea, Vietnam, Iraq 2003).

Dave

Of course the Swift Boat team was in bad taste and obviously Bush benefited off of them but this is valid when Olbermann is making Gingrich out to be some anti-freedom of speech Nazi over his advocating against the freedoms of terrorists. Newt was primarily talking about jihadists websites too.

Yes, it is fair to say Johnson lost his reelection bid. From wikipedia “his reelection bid in 1968 collapsed as a result of turmoil in his party”….So yea, he lost the reelection bid.

I know republicans were distancing themselves from Bush. What I was getting at here is Olby’s overdramatic “No you’re finished Mister Bush!”. Olbermann is so obviously playing to his irrational ‘hate Bush’ base that it’s embarrassing that he’s even considered a ‘journalist’.

So next, you are just talking about the inherent nature of “unstable governments” and how you believe it is doomed to fail. OK. Again, Obviously, unstable governments don’t help anything but this is about more Olbyspin that were sending victimized kids “Until hell freezes over!” to their sure deaths. The fact that the government is unstable is, of course, valid in rational debate…but in Olbyworld it’s used to insult both the President and Bill O’Reilly, not to make any coherent point of argument.

You basically say in the last paragraph that we never should have gone to Iraq. That’s your opinion and you may well turn out to be correct. I still believe that the “hands tied behind the back” is valid. I’m not the only one with that opinion, most military men of the time have it too. Again, you CAN believe that going into Vietnam was wrong and still understand that we fought it all incorrectly. This manner in which we fought is what ultimately doomed us, not choosing the wrong fight. That is what is impossible to drill into the mind of Olbyloons. Yea, Nam looks like a stupid war to have fought in hindsight…but we could have won in months had we done it right.

How are the South Vietnamese people or Iraqi people supposed to think well of us when all they see is anti-war press and a country that’s ready to pull out? Would you as an Iraqi fight for freedom when it’s almost certain that you’re going to be abandon by the U.S.? Why not seek protection from the Shiite rebels who look like the new top dog with their new Iranian guns? I see a stronger link between our determination(or lack there of) and the resolve of the insurgency than anything else. So yea, we probably will lose Iraq.

Dave

Of course the Swift Boat team was in bad taste and obviously Bush benefited off of them but this is valid when Olbermann is making Gingrich out to be some anti-freedom of speech Nazi over his advocating against the freedoms of terrorists. Newt was primarily talking about jihadists websites too.

Yes, it is fair to say Johnson lost his reelection bid. From wikipedia “his reelection bid in 1968 collapsed as a result of turmoil in his party”….So yea, he lost the reelection bid.

I know republicans were distancing themselves from Bush. What I was getting at here is Olby’s overdramatic “No you’re finished Mister Bush!”. Olbermann is so obviously playing to his irrational ‘hate Bush’ base that it’s embarrassing that he’s even considered a ‘journalist’.

So next, you are just talking about the inherent nature of “unstable governments” and how you believe it is doomed to fail. OK. Again, Obviously, unstable governments don’t help anything but this is about more Olbyspin that were sending victimized kids “Until hell freezes over!” to their sure deaths. The fact that the government is unstable is, of course, valid in rational debate…but in Olbyworld it’s used to insult both the President and Bill O’Reilly, not to make any coherent point of argument.

You basically say in the last paragraph that we never should have gone to Iraq. That’s your opinion and you may well turn out to be correct. I still believe that the “hands tied behind the back” is valid. I’m not the only one with that opinion, most military men of the time have it too. Again, you CAN believe that going into Vietnam was wrong and still understand that we fought it all incorrectly. This manner in which we fought is what ultimately doomed us, not choosing the wrong fight. That is what is impossible to drill into the mind of Olbyloons. Yea, Nam looks like a stupid war to have fought in hindsight…but we could have won in months had we done it right.

How are the South Vietnamese people or Iraqi people supposed to think well of us when all they see is anti-war press and a country that’s ready to pull out? Would you as an Iraqi fight for freedom when it’s almost certain that you’re going to be abandon by the U.S.? Why not seek protection from the Shiite rebels who look like the new top dog with their new Iranian guns? I see a stronger link between our determination(or lack there of) and the resolve of the insurgency than anything else. So yea, we probably will lose Iraq.

O'Lie-

Nice...Stop wars by killing your own leaders...makes sense on Olby-planet

So, taking this to the next step, the members of the continental army, should have killed Geo Washington, Franklin, Jefferson, et al. instead of fighting the British and winning independence from England

The GI's of the 1940's should have killed Patton, MacArthur, FDR, Harry Truman, et al and let the Japanese have the Pacific and the western edge of the US while letting Hitlerand his ilk complete thetake over of Europe, Northern Africa, the USSR

If those guys had only done any of that, then Vietnam and Iraq would never have happened and O'Lie would be happy and he could kick back and watch Olbermann and....umm, wait a sec...no revolutionary war...no creation of USA, no bill of rights, no first amendment freedom of the press...no Olby...what to do, what to do, what to do...