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    Olbermann Watch, "persecuting" Keith since 2004


    April 3, 2007
    Countdown with Keith Olbermann - April 3, 2007

    "COUNTDOWN WITH KEITH OLBERMANN" (8:00 P.M.-9:00 P.M. ET)

    Host: Keith Olbermann

    Topics/Guests:

    • IRAQ: Sen. Russ Feingold (D-Wisc.)
    • CONGRESSIONAL PHOTO-OP IN BAGHDAD: Larry Johnson, fmr. CIA officer and fmr. deputy director of the Office of Counterterrorism at the State Department
    • ELECTION 2008: Chris Cillizza, washingtonpost.com
    • "AMERICAN IDOL": Maria Milito, Q104.3 radio host

    The future of television news gave his usual nuanced reading of the opening spiel: the most vacationed President in history (source?), Democrats are "apopleptic" and a "special guest" will give a "rebuttal". Plus another "rebuttal", this time to Richard McCain from "analysts". O.J. Simpson, Anna Nicole Smith, why "we all hate Rush Limbaugh", Keith Richards, and more. Sixty minutes of OlbySpin start now.

    UPDATE (RCox): Transcript & Video

    Fox News Channel's Bill O'Reilly book Culture Warrior

    #5: "Mister" Bush has spent 405 days at his Crawford ranch and wants Congress back to "rubber stamp his war in Iraq". It's "hypocrisy!" bellowed Keitho, as the graphic read "BULLY pulpit". Keith also lied that previous Iraq funding bills were "blank checks". After a few clips from the press conference with "Mister" Bush, Oralmann brought on the latest in his ongoing series: Blue Dress Interviews with Deep Blue Democrats. Yes, this time it was Russ Feingold. And if you haven't examined The List, you should stop everything and do so now. It is irrefutable proof that Krazy Keith is a slovenly political hack.

    It was another incisive grilling by Herr Olbermann, as his laser-like questions had Feingold on the hot seat:

    • It seems hard to be surprised by this President any more, but did he go above and beyond something today?
    • Is it possible that the President does not realize that this group of some people constitutes about seven out of every ten Americans?
    • How do we get that done if the President is going to be in this form of obstinence and denial?
    • The President was forced to admit that what you are your colleagues are doing is entirely legitimate. Doesn't that make his veto the cause of any interruption of funding for the troops?
    • The President also talked about the consequences of failure in Iraq. And a failed state in Iraq would somehow be your fault? I'm missing something in the logical chain there. Do you know what it is?

    Send this tape to the Murrow awards committee. This was speaking truth to power! Feingold wiped the stain from his pants; he was Great Thanksed.

    #4 was the latest installment of Olbermann's war against Richard McCain. Monkeymann insisted that McCain's visit to Iraq risked the lives of our troops for "a photo-op" (Blue Blog Source: No Quarter). Then we got a rerun of Dirty Olby and Crazy Larry, the latter being the Nostradamus who said, two months before 9/11, that we shouldn't fear terrorism. Bin Laden is not a threat. And other insights. Johnson is a partisan Democrat, but of course Olbermoronn doesn't mention that. Only a mental case would believe anything from Crazy Larry, but that's our Keith! Great thanks.

    #3: Clinton vs Obama vs Edwards. Who's up? Who's down? Cillizza said cancer has helped Edwards in the polls. Stop the presses! Worst person in the world! Crassly dragging politics into a personal... Oh wait, we are on OlbyPlanet. Scratch that. KO said the Baghdad trip could be McCain's Dukakis-in-a-tank moment. Demeaning a P.O.W. again, Lt Olbermahn? Giuliani's wife could be a "killer" of his chances. Hey, two in a row for Rule #1 (whatever happens, it's bad for Bush/Republicans/conservatives). Then Olby turned to Mitt Romney: a lot of his money comes from Utah. Aha! A hat-trick! Great thanks.

    #2: Alcoholic punch (regurgitated video), Keith Richards, Knight Rider, Anna Nicole Smith. #1: More Anna Nicole Smith. In the Media Matters Minute, Rush Limbaugh was again attacked, this time for making a joke about the shooting at CNN Center. We're skeptical about this item, but unlike Edward R Olbermann we won't report without having the facts. But it is ironic. The CNN shooting is the story that A-Mess-NBC was ordered not to cover!

    Stories Olbermann refuses to report

    Hushed hounds: The infamous, deplorable Keith Olbermann attacked Matt Drudge for reporting a story based on an anonymous source (like Olby never does that). Will he do the same for a smear based on no source at all? For that matter, will he report the new developments in the original Drudge controversy? Will he tell his viewers that Iran could be just two years away from a nuclear weapon? Given that he hasn't even said one syllable about Iran's kidnapping of coalition soldiers, the answer to all these questions is: not on OlbyPlanet, he won't.

    NAME

    Olbermann's book The book that bears Olbermann's name has soared to #27,983 at amazon.com, while "Culture Warrior" is #352. (It's that 2-for-$25 sale!) The OlbyTome is #3,929 at Barnes & Noble; O'Reilly's book is #314 there, and is one of the top five books of 2006 per Publishers Weekly. Monday is Olbermoronn's strongest day, and he did barely squeak into second place both in total viewers and in the critical, beloved, all-important, coveted "key demo". Tonight's MisterMeter reading: 5 [ELEVATED]

    Journalism held hostage by Keith Olbermann: Day 12.

    UPDATE (RCox): Transcript & Video

    Read the transcript of Tuesday's show

    Keith Olbermann interviews Sen. Russ Feingold (D-WI)

    Keith Olbermann interviews Larry Johnson


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    332 Comments

    Still nothing on Iran?
    Come on Olby fans admitt it.
    Olby is Pro-Iran!

    Another Brilliant summary.

    Johnny $, this is a tremendous cross to bear.

    Watching KO everynight with a barf bag close by.

    His deplorability strives to new levels with each and every installment.

    He is despicable as in NBC News which worships at the Alter of Advertiser Greed.

    The List...what can you say? speechless!

    Maybe Russert should interogate OLBY about the list? What would Russert think about the list? or Lauer? or Williams?

    Abrams has a chubby over the list.

    What a coup de tat at NBC news.

    AlJazeera @ 30 Rock...

    AlJazeera @ 30 Rock....

    This hypocrite never has an opposing view on,only those who agree with his point of view. How does he dare criticize Fox who at least has alternative viewpoints. What a pathetic joke this guy is.

    JOURNALISM HELD HOSTAGE"...LMAO

    Oh please ... "one reporter" who "giggled" in the "background" of McCain does not constitute heckling, nor is this a straight duck of standards. More like a cop-out, if you ask me ---

    I'm sorry but the Iran capturing the British sailors is just a non story. Anyway, I find Rush Limbaugh so much more dangerous than the guy in Tehran.

    Well I was right that Olberass would make Patriot Rush Limbaugh WPITW but it was not for what I thought. Not sure what Blue Blog source he used, but it could not have been Media Matters. Glad to see that Tom Delay's book is more popular than Olbermann. Delay was demonized by the socialist media, but Olbermann is a Jihadist loving, Socialist Nazi who goose steps for fellow Nazi George Soreass. I personally don't care that McCain is getting heckled now by the same left wing media whose ass he tried to kiss while stabbing fellow republicans in the back. That Rhino gets what he deserves. It is entertaining though that all these liberals who said that the Vietnam vets were politically un-touchable are now slamming a vet who was a POW. I guess they only care about vets who stab themselves in the leg to come home, call their fellow vets child murdering war criminals, and become democrats. Good lesson for Rhino McCain. The left will only support you when you are bashing your fellow republicans.

    Thank God For Bill O’Reilly! I was just another Secular Progressive tricked by the Liberal Media. I never knew I had a choice. I thought I had to be Liberal, and Secular, and Progressive. Thanks to Bill O’Reilly I now know I don’t have to live like that anymore! I can be an Arrogant Bigoted Blow Hard, Never Admit I’m Wrong, and Never Have to Say I’m Sorry. I Must Admit, it was never much fun being Thoughtful, Contemplative, Empathetic…I am so glad I don’t have to put up with all the SP BS any longer. Thanks Bill for Opening My Eyes to how the other half lives!

    Thank you, thank God for Bill O'Reilly, for providing some of that Colbert-like satire concerning that evil Bill O. Let's just hope some of these right wing knuckle draggers will appreciate your humor. By the way, what should I do about the Iran-British hostage thingy? Should I keep ignoring it?

    You tell em, Factor!

    You're such a fine upstanding patriot. It just gives me goose bumps the way you cut right through the bull!

    "...I personally don't care that McCain is getting heckled now by the same left wing media whose ass he tried to kiss while stabbing fellow republicans in the back. That Rhino gets what he deserves...Posted by: The Factor at April 3, 2007 11:30 PM "

    Typical fake conservative pea brain idiot.

    Talking sh-t about a real war veteran while pretending he is not. What the f--- kind of idiotic crap is this? McCain was screwed by Karl Rove in his bid for the White House, Bush wins the election and then goes on to destroy the reputation of Republicans.

    Factor here, with a full rectal cranial inversion, talks about the so called liberal press being the ones who screw McCain.

    It was dumb a--holes like you who have kept John McCain out of the White House. Instead you just do what Rush and Fox Noise tells you to do. Support Bush and Cheney.

    This so called liberal press you keep talking about didn't put George Bush in the White House did it? Did this liberal press decide John McCain would not be the one the hillbilly idiots vote for or was that Fox Noise and Rush? Bush won twice not McCain, that is the fault of Republican voters you dumb f---ing a--hole.

    This Liberal press is it putting dead Iraqis or dead GI's on the headlines daily? No they are not. Not like they did in Vietnam. And why is that? Because it is not a liberal press. It is a corporate ran empire that does the bidding of the power structure the USA controls.

    You have your head up your ass so far that you count your teeth. Get a clue you loser.

    I Must Admit, it was never much fun being Thoughtful, Contemplative, Empathetic…I am so glad I don’t have to put up with all the SP BS any longer. Thanks Bill for Opening My Eyes to how the other half lives!
    Thank God For Bill O'Reilly at April 3, 2007 11:36 PM

    SP are not thoughtful (Rosie O'Donnell), are not Contemplative (Bill Clinton), and are not Empathetic (Keith Olbermann). SP are responsible for the death of billions with their dictatorships and failed policies(Stalin, Fidel, Mao, etc). SP are racist (Rosie Ching Chong). They hate minorities and the poor (France, Lydon Johnson). They hate freedom of speech, free exercise of religion, and the right to bare arms. Basically SP's are the worst people on the planet. Bill might have opened you eyes, but you head is still stuck up your ass.

    Bill O's not Evil...

    He's just a blowhard.

    And yes, Keith, you should do the Iran hostage thingy. Why haven't you ?

    Eventually it will become yet another story that makes Mr.Bush look bad, and you're gonna wish you were in on it from the beginning.

    BTW, enough with the pinstripes and polka dots.

    ....And Yankees suck, Braves Rule!

    SP are not thoughtful (Rosie O'Donnell), are not comtemplative (Bill Clinton), and are not Empathetic (Keith Olbermann),"

    But YOU are Factor...your such a fine upstanding patriotic O'Reilly lovin clear thinker. It's just so wonderfull America has patriots like you to defend us from the SP's.

    You think Rosie, Clinty, and Olby represent SP's?

    Then I guess you don't mind me telling you that Jimmie Swaggart, Eric Rudolph, and 'that religious dude that got caught smoking some male prostitutes pole' (sorry his name escapes me, but he was a prominent religious figure) is representative of the Religious Right in this country?

    Yeah, so I guess it's easy to conjure up names of flawed polarizing figures to make a point.

    Wow, say something about Bill-o and you get so hot and bothered. You must be the one under his desk during the taping of his show that keeps that big smile on his face.

    ...And I love freedom of speech. It makes it easier to tell who the real racists are: YOU!

    First of all, Coward Watch, your name is dangerously close to Olbermann Watch, so be careful. Factor was calling John Kerry a despicable veteran, not McCain. Get off your lefty high horse and face the facts. McCain isn't the media's golden boy of late, mostly because he's been taking Democrats to task and not his fellow republicans. Yes, we conservatives put George W. Bush in the White House, in spite of the best efforts of the old media. And thank God we did. I shudder to think of America under the regime of either Gore or Kerry. And CW, try posting next time without any profanity. It reflects poorly on you and your fellow leftists.

    P.S. I'm not sure who is in more dire need of a beating about the head and shoulders. Olbermann or the dumb dumb who invented the W stickers with a line through it. Sooooooo Clever. Also, any lib out there having trouble parting with the Kerry/Edwards bumberstickers, I'd be more than happy to scrape them off.

    Down with the Left!!!

    >Yeah, so I guess it's easy to conjure up names of flawed polarizing figures to make a point.

    The difference is the people that you named don't try to act 'holier than thou.'

    The fine upstanding folks I mentioned commit their hypocrisies, then try to act holier than thou....ala Newt Gingrich.

    But that's what I expect from someone who calls themselves 'The Factor.'

    It's okay if you do it, just don't get caught!

    Factor here thinks he is a conservative and at the same time talks about Social Progressives being against the constitution.

    Any real American conservative will tell you that this administration is the biggest threat to constitutional rights ever. 100% of the NRA Republicans I know all say Bush and Cheney are a Trojan horse to gun rights. They hate the secrecy and required loyalty of Bush Cheney and do tell anyone who would listen that they are the worst threat to civil liberties that have yet to come up the political pike.

    Factor here is about as conservative as Jane Fonda at an ACLU rally. The guy is so full of sh-t he could bag it and sell it to fish as fertilizer.

    http://www.sianews.com/index.php

    >Also, any lib out there having trouble parting with the Kerry/Edwards bumberstickers, I'd be more than happy to scrape them off.

    Pat-But to still collect unemployment, you'll have to prove you were looking for a job while scraping 'bumber' stickers.

    You think Rosie, Clinty, and Olby represent SP's? Thank God For Bill O'Reilly at April 4, 2007 12:01 AM

    No I think Lennon, Mao, Kim Jung Ill, Stalin, and Putin represent SP's. The rest of those idiots are the propaganda spewers.

    You want to talk about hypocrites? How about the left's poolboy, Keith Olbermann, lecturing people on not comparing opponents to nazis, then doing a seig heil with a Bill O'Reilly mask. Classy! If he was at an actual news network, his orange self would have been sacked.

    By the way, the whole Fox noise thing has grown a little tiresome. You see, people can call NBC News NBC Noise. That's because the word news is in their title as well. Get it. Good.

    "...Factor was calling John Kerry a despicable veteran, not McCain. Get off your lefty high horse and face the facts....Posted by: Pat Fegan at April 4, 2007 12:04 AM "
    --------------------------------------------------------------------
    "...I personally don't care that McCain is getting heckled now by the same left wing media whose ass he tried to kiss while stabbing fellow republicans in the back. That Rhino gets what he deserves...Posted by: The Factor at April 3, 2007 11:30 PM "

    -----------------------------------

    Paddy'O Fegan what part of "McCain" can't you read? Does that look like "Kerry" in plain English or are you on some kind of mushrooms???

    You tell em, Factor!

    You're such a fine upstanding patriot. It just gives me goose bumps the way you cut right through the bull!

    Posted by: Mike at April 3, 2007 11:51 PM
    The Factor was right, that's what pisses you off so much. Factor, I couldn't agree with you more!

    Wow Jeff and Factor joining forces...reminds me of that famous movie....Dumb and Dumber! That was a hoot too!

    But YOU are Factor...your such a fine upstanding patriotic O'Reilly lovin clear thinker. It's just so wonderfull America has patriots like you to defend us from the SP's.

    Posted by: Mike at April 3, 2007 11:58 PM
    For once, you are right. I have never seen Factor run and hide from a simple question, or any question. More than I can say about the cowards twin brother. Why is the Iran hostage situation not a "political" one, lil mikey? Got an answer, yet?

    Olbermann Watch, I mean Coward Watch, Factor wasn't taking McCain to task over him being a veteran but for his RINO tendencies. Read the last part and though he didn't mention Kerry by name, he certainly made it clear . Stabbing fellow veterans in the back, calling them baby killers, being a democrat. etc...

    By the way, the whole Fox noise thing has grown a little tiresome. You see, people can call NBC News NBC Noise. That's because the word news is in their title as well. Get it. Good.

    Posted by: Pat Fegan at April 4, 2007 12:13 AM

    ------------------------------

    Personally I like "Fix Noise" best. Fix the blunders of Bush Cheney.

    Fix Noise is exactly what they are.

    And for you to be able to label a person as being on the left you would have to be a person of right wing views. You are not. Right wing people hate big government who wipe their ass with our Constitution. What you are is a coward who sucks up to political figures your fear mongering media tells you to suck up to for a little comfort from your fears. Terrorized by Fox and supporting Bush Cheney does make you "right" about anything. You are in no way a right wing person, that is a for sure solid fact!

    Jeff baby, didn't you say earlier today that you were gonna start ignoring me....or was that lie number 103?

    John McCain voted against tax cuts and against free speach with his McCain Finegold bill. He is a Rino. He is also a war hero and a good man but you can be a good man and a war hero and a bad conservative. By the way, I have constantly said the George Bush is not a conservative. He is a JFK democrat. I would rather have a JFK democrat in power than a Euorpean Socialist. If John McCain wins the nomination, I will vote for him.

    How are we terrorized by Fox News? And were you asleep during the Clinton years and the assault on the constitution during his reign of terror?

    Please America, boycott the NBC Nigtly Noise. Thank you.

    No, I'm pretty righ wing.

    "John McCain voted against tax cuts" (for the rich) "and against free speech with his McCain Finegold bill."
    'I Wrong again Factor, I don't think the Constitutional framers considered pouring money into politics to be "free speech" for one second.

    No I think Lennon, Mao, Kim Jung Ill, Stalin, and Putin...

    are Secular Progressives? Are you an Idiot?

    Factor- you should look up what it means to be a secular humanist. It means you put people's rights and human concerns above all else.

    How is Kim Jung Ill doing on human rights?

    You sadly think being as SP is what you've been told it is, what you've been spoon fed. How about seeing for yourself what it ACTUALLY is...

    "How are we terrorized by Fox News?"

    I don't know Pat...I"m not sure I'd call spreading ignorance as "terrorizing", but they might have contributed heavily to some pretty stupid decisions...such as invading Iraq!

    Factor sleeps with a Bill O'Reilly Nite Light...

    To protect him from the...

    And you know this about the framers how, Mike. Have you been in touch with them, like Hillary was in touch with Eleanor Roosevelt? The framers said we can lobby our government. Period. I don't see any notes in the margins there.

    Fox helped influence the decision to invade Iraq? In the words of Johnny Carson, " I did not know that."

    "...Why is the Iran hostage situation not a "political" one, lil mikey? Got an answer, yet?
    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 12:17 AM

    Look you dumb ass hillbilly, the reason the US media is not making hay about Iran holding hostages is because it is glaringly evident that they took the hostages to demonstrate how powerless the US and Great Briton are to do anything about it. Why are we powerless? Because Bozo there in the White House has destroyed the US credibility on the planet.

    You are so f---ing dumb I can't think of words to describe you and the rest of your retarded Bozo lovers.

    Iran knows what it is doing and it is because of a--holes like you and Factor and all the other Bozo lovers here that they can do it. You'd give Bush your approval to sell your mother into prostitution if you thought it would make you safer from the boogie man with a beard and a diaper on his head.

    Iran is making headlines everywhere but here. That is because it makes Bush out to be the powerless monkey that he is. We have been saying this to your forever on this page. Iran is doing what it is and has been doing (defying the world about nuclear ambitions) simply because the neo-cons f---ed up royal in their quest to take an oil rich nation in the heart of the Persian Gulf. They did it on the cheap and they did while ignoring the advice of generals who knew the correct way to go about it.

    You are real idiot you know that? But what can you expect from an a--hole with the moniker "royalKing". How f---ing lame can you get?

    And as for your calling Mike "mikey" just remember he is the vet not you. You are a pussy coward who lives in fear and bases all your beliefs on what quells your cowardice.

    Just a typical low life coward!

    Fox helped influence the decision to invade Iraq? In the words of Johnny Carson, " I did not know that."

    Posted by: Pat at April 4, 2007 12:33 AM

    Hey ace Rupert Murdoch has publicly acknowledged this and said he was proud of it.

    http://scoop.epluribusmedia.org/story/2007/2/3/20443/36412

    Mike, let's just say that many a celebrity on the left, let's call them a secular progressive, is infatuated with Communist dictators.

    Everyone piles on Mel Gibson's dad ( and rightfully so ) for his comments about the holocaust. But let's also pile on Sean Penn's deceased father Leo, an actor and director in his own right, who was a huge admirerer of Jozef Stalin, who in the 1930's, starved to death 15 million Russians and Ukaranians. For that alone, I'd take a nice long leak on Leo Penn's grave.

    I don't think the Constitutional framers considered pouring money into politics to be "free speech" for one second.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:26 AM

    If you don't contributing to a political campaigns so the candidates can run adds is free speech then you are a moron. Its called political speech. Because of McCain/Feingold, the Left Wing media is now the 4th branch of government and is trying to influence votes. Go vote for who MSRNC tell you to. You are looking for big brother, the left wing media is big brother and you are the sheep gobbling up their propaganda.

    Quote me someone from the administration, ace. Otherwise, I'm embarassed for you.

    The Iran hostage situation demonstrates how weak the English have become. We'd be more than happy to kick some Iranian ass if Tony Blair was on board with it. We have war ships in the very waters where the Iranian seized the Brits. I don't call that weakness.

    I don't think the Constitutional framers considered pouring money into politics to be "free speech" for one second.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:26 AM

    Pouring whose money? John Q Public's money or billions from the Fortune 500?

    There is no way the framers of the Constitution would ever have approved of turning the political process they framed into process of pimps and whores as it is now. You live in a huge state of denial to not acknowledge this. And yes it is precisely because of Constitutional rights that it has come to what it is today. This was not foreseen and something should be done about it. Unless you are one of the Fortune 500 companies you would have to be a royal a--hole to not want an end to the take over of our government by huge corporations.

    You are truely anti democratic and anti-American

    Candidates from both parties are raking in the dough. Queen Hillary now has 26 million in the war chest. McCain/Feingold is working great, Beaver.

    The Iran hostage situation demonstrates how weak the English have become. We'd be more than happy to kick some Iranian ass if Tony Blair was on board with it. We have war ships in the very waters where the Iranian seized the Brits. I don't call that weakness.

    Posted by: Pat at April 4, 2007 12:47 AM

    More blow hard bull sh-t out of the mouth of and an idiot. You trying to tell me that Bush would go into Iran? He and Cheney long ago wanted Iran as the ultimate goal. They would do it in a heart beat if they could but because of the royal screw up they have created in Iraq the support is not there.

    You live in a purple crayon world of pretend. You have no clue what you are talking about. We don't need Blair's approval anymore than we needed it to go into Iraq. What we need is just another Pearl Harbor. Right? But they shot that wad with the creation of 911. Now their credibility is zilch.

    Just like yours!

    Coward Watch: Were you calling me or Factor "anti democratic and anti_American"?

    Why did you use my post as a point of disagreement? Can't you tell when someone agrees with you?

    Paddy O'Fegan,

    Queen Hillary was chosen for the Presidency many years ago by the same power structure that decided on Bush as the man to lead the bible belt Christians into a holy war.

    Hillary will be the next president. It was decided long ago.

    Get a f---ing clue. Real Progressives hate Hillary in the same manner real conservatives hate Bush/Cheney.

    You live in a Fix Noise delusional world.

    We have war ships in the very waters where the Iranian seized the Brits. I don't call that weakness.
    Posted by: Pat at April 4, 2007 12:47 AM

    All Braun and No Brain is a weakness you fool!

    Actually, Bush is deferring to Tony Blair on this because the sailors are British.

    Are you saying we created 911? And still no quotes from Bush cabinet members on how they were swayed into invading Iraq because of Fox News. Hmmm. How's your credibility right now? All this time, I've been talking to a loon. Well, there's a couple hours I'll never get back. Watch out, I think Kool Aid is about to film a commercial at your house. Gang way before the guy comes crashing through your dry wall!

    And as for your calling Mike "mikey" just remember he is the vet not you. You are a pussy coward who lives in fear and bases all your beliefs on what quells your cowardice.

    Just a typical low life coward!


    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 12:35 AM
    Who said I lived in fear? I am afraid or fear no one, especially radical muslims, like you. I would like to see one try to come through my gate. If they got past my heeler, they would then have to deal with me.....

    Factor spews about money in politics: "Its called political speech".

    No Factor, you're SO confused...it's called 'money', and a system that allows only the wealthy (You know, the ones with money) to exercise 'free' political 'speech' is inheritantly flawed.

    >And still no quotes from Bush cabinet members on how they were swayed into invading Iraq because of Fox News. Hmmm.

    The absence of proof is not proof of absence...

    We'll haveto wait and see how it all plays out, boogy man.

    uh oh, coward watch has turned against lil mikey, his former defender.

    >And still no quotes from Bush cabinet members on how they were swayed into invading Iraq because of Fox News. Hmmm.

    ...And Bush never said 'I do Laura Doggy Style' either, but I bet he does!

    Jeff: "I am afraid or fear no one"

    Oooohhh Jeff...you're SO tough!

    But apparently not tough enough to help out old Uncle Sam, who really does need some dedicated patriots to "fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here".

    "How are we terrorized by Fox News?"

    I don't know Pat...I"m not sure I'd call spreading ignorance as "terrorizing", but they might have contributed heavily to some pretty stupid decisions...such as invading Iraq!

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:28 AM
    A conspiracy theorist, aligning himself with Rosie, not surprised.

    A well struck blow for rational thought, Booger man.

    You live in a purple crayon world of pretend. You have no clue what you are talking about. We don't need Blair's approval anymore than we needed it to go into Iraq. What we need is just another Pearl Harbor. Right? But they shot that wad with the creation of 911. Now their credibility is zilch.

    Just like yours!

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 12:55 AM
    CW just showed his true colors. He is a 9/11 conspiracy nut just like Rosie. Bush and the Free Masons hypnotized the Media and invented 9/11. What a joke. You are a true disgrace. I guess you fee Pearl Harbor was invented also. Coward Watch, if you are looking for Cowards, go buy a mirror.

    Coward Watch: Were you calling me or Factor "anti democratic and anti_American"?

    Why did you use my post as a point of disagreement? Can't you tell when someone agrees with you?
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Good point, I did leave off Factor's comment. Sorry about that. But I did address his commentary sufficiently to show it was him that I was slamming not you.

    Agrees with me? I would have be even more arrogant than I already am to think I could get these brain washed pin heads to agree with me.

    I am calling Factor the anti-democratic and anti-American when I suggest that he thinks it is perfectly agreeable to have Washington DC be a corporate occupied territory instead of the place of doing the peoples business.

    I know your style is the opposite of mine and you may find me offensive but you are just to kind to see the world the way I do. These guys give you little respect simply and they deserve none that you give them.

    You are better than I at patience. I believe I am meeting them halfway.

    Who said I lived in fear? I am afraid or fear no one, especially radical muslims, like you. I would like to see one try to come through my gate. If they got past my heeler, they would then have to deal with me.....
    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 1:03 AM

    If they get past my heeler, they would have to deal with me? That sounds mighty brave tough guy. Send the dog out to go get the 'radical muslims.' And how pray tell would you know they were 'radical muslims' Jeff? The towels on their heads?

    > Rupert Murdoch has publicly acknowledged this

    And then he gives a link where Murdoch says the opposite, that he would have liked to influence the policy, but DIDN'T. If you cite evidence that actually says the opposite of the point you are trying to make, you just might be an Olbyloon.

    A well struck blow for rational thought, Booger man.
    Posted by: Pat at April 4, 2007 1:09 AM

    Thanks Patty Cakes, I thought you'd like that one. I just get sick of the fine folks who think if there isn't immediate proof of something it must not be so. Take belief in God for instance...

    "Aligning himself with Rosie"

    Not really....if I've "aligned myself with" anyone, it would be someone like Bill Maher.

    Rosie speaks for herself, and no one else, but she has every right to say what she pleases, as long as ABC lets her say it.

    No Factor, you're SO confused...it's called 'money', and a system that allows only the wealthy (You know, the ones with money) to exercise 'free' political 'speech' is inheritantly flawed.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:03 AM

    Sure Mike. We know you only want the Unions, The ARP, and the Trail Lawyers to donate money. That way you can the liberal media in your pocket and all the commercial time you need. Everyone who donates money to political campaigns is a special interest group. Name one group who gives to political campaigns who is not a special interest group? You want to eliminate money in politics? Then make it illegal to donate to political campaigns period.

    what's a trail lawyer?

    Coward Watch,
    How've you been? I see you're still spewing the same crap.
    How come your hero Teheran Keith isn't discussing the Hostage crisis with Iran?
    Care to answer?

    Exactly, SP Booger Eater. I mean, since when does an allegation like Fox News helped Bush decide to invade Iraq need the slightest shred of proof! An original thinker, that's what you are. And as for the God thing, I couldn't agree more. Just looking at our vast universe, I can't help but be humbled by the big bang theory.

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 12:55 AM
    CW just showed his true colors. He is a 9/11 conspiracy nut just like Rosie. Bush and the Free Masons hypnotized the Media and invented 9/11. What a joke. You are a true disgrace. I guess you fee Pearl Harbor was invented also. Coward Watch, if you are looking for Cowards, go buy a mirror.

    Posted by: The Factor at April 4, 2007 1:09 AM
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    You can't comment on whether 911 was a conspiracy or not unless you take the time to view the hundreds of videos on Google and Youtube and read some the blogs on the subject. Instead the best you can do is take Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh rhetoric as the golden rule.

    When Hillary Clinton becomes president do will you really believe that John McCain couldn't have defeated her? Do you really believe that John Kerry would say nothing and Al Gore would say nothing when it was an easy thing to do to show how the vote was fixed?

    Kerry could never have gotten the support of bible belt Christians to send their sons fathers and brothers off to die for oil wealth. But George Bush could.

    The whole thing is about oil and the control of it. Afghanistan was about stopping the Soviet Union from getting there first. Soon after they backed out who went in and took control of the region? How do you get our nation of video game playing - Internet porn surfing men to get off the couch and go to war? How do you that? Do you hope Bin Laden will strike or do you make sure when he does it works in your favor and not his?

    This says nothing about how I feel about the USA having control of the middle east oil production - just as long as it is done with the rich people paying their fair share. But Bush is making the poor people pay the price while the rich get richer. This f---ing sucks and so do you for supporting it. Oil or no oil the way Bush and Cheney are running things is a huge benefit to the rich while the GI's who die in Iraq loose their homes do to failing mortgages.

    Because you are a Fox News monkey you would not know anything about actually picking up a gun and fighting and dying for your country. You my friend are a plain and simple coward.

    Factor, in the ideal world, NO group...INCLUDING Unions, ARP, the Trial Lawyers, along with corporate interests, or the wealthy should donate money to political campaigns beyond a minimum amount that EVERYONE could afford.

    Until we get ALL corporations, and ALL political action groups, and ALL lobbyists completely out of politics, our work is not done.

    As for your dreaded so called 'liberal media', it's the ONLY thing standing between you...and totalitarianism!

    Mike, hitching your wagon to Bill Maher, are you? Good luck with that.

    And then he gives a link where Murdoch says the opposite, that he would have liked to influence the policy, but DIDN'T. If you cite evidence that actually says the opposite of the point you are trying to make, you just might be an Olbyloon.
    Posted by: johnny dollar at April 4, 2007 1:16 AM

    Sorry, Johnny, Logic Alert!

    Trying and Failing at something is NOT the opposite of DOING something.

    NOT Trying and Succeeding at NOT trying is the opposite of DOING.

    Haven't taken those courses in logic I recommended, eh?

    Money is how a canidate gets his message out. TV time cost money, radio adds cost money, and going from state to state cost money. That is freedom of speach. If we eliminate money from politics then all you have is canidates who can afford to run with their own money. Good Bye Obamanation. Hellow Hillary.

    Coward Watch,
    "Because it is not a liberal press. "

    Why is the press supporting Iran?

    Pat-

    I stopped reading at 'Booger Eater'

    Did you say something important?

    I mean, important to someone past the third grade?

    You want to eliminate money in politics? Then make it illegal to donate to political campaigns period.


    Posted by: The Factor at April 4, 2007 1:21 AM

    Tax payers are paying a huge price with the system of political donations we have today. 60 Minutes last Sunday had a great piece on how pharmaceutical companies own congress. You missed that I am sure.

    We need to have all campaigns paid for by tax dollars. This would be a HUGE savings to the tax payers. What we are paying now with price fixing and monopolies is way to much.

    Get a clue my friend. Go to school and get an education.

    These are indeed perilous times for our country. When the major media outlets are almost exclusively in bed with liberals and democrats. It's time for a little diversity in the newsroom. When a known hack like Olbermann can pass himself off as a journalist, these are indeed the times that try men's souls.

    So, Mike. What do you think George Bush would do if it wasn't for those brave folks in the left wing media? Care to go down in flames like Coward Watch?

    Coward Watch,

    "The whole thing is about oil and the control of it. "

    Can you then explain the Jihad of the 7th-9th Centuries against the East Roman Empire, Persia, Spain and India?
    What does that have to do with oil?

    "Just looking at our vast universe, I can't help but be humbled by the big bang theory."

    That's not the universe, that's your cavernous rectum.

    Big Bang indeed!

    He won't cover the kidnapping
    But his lips just keep on flapping
    Captured soldiers are droll
    When there's Anna Nicole
    NBC needs a bitch-slapping

    Coward Watch,
    Why do you support Jihadists?

    Factor, in the ideal world, NO group...INCLUDING Unions, ARP, the Trial Lawyers, along with corporate interests, or the wealthy should donate money to political campaigns beyond a minimum amount that EVERYONE could afford.

    Until we get ALL corporations, and ALL political action groups, and ALL lobbyists completely out of politics, our work is not done.

    As for your dreaded so called 'liberal media', it's the ONLY thing standing between you...and totalitarianism!

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:27 AM
    Thank God for The Swift Boaters!

    I was agreeing with you, SPBM. The more outlandish the accusation against the Bush administration, the less need there is for proof. I'm on YOUR side.

    Royalking,
    Coward Watch probably thinks that the KKK did 9/11.

    I laughed out loud at the cavernous rectum part. Bully for you, anonymous poster.

    Coward Watch: Were you calling me or Factor "anti democratic and anti_American"?

    Why did you use my post as a point of disagreement? Can't you tell when someone agrees with you?

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:59 AM
    See what happens when you side with the enemy? They chop your head off! Live and learn, lil mikey.

    Pat and Royalking,
    What's your theories as to why the Leftist press is Pro-Iran?
    Do you guys think the Iranians are paying people like Ulbermahn and Rosie O'Donnel off?

    It's 12:42 AM. Does Keith Olbermann know where his integrity is?

    Mike,
    Don't calloabo with CW. He's out there.

    Joker, Mister Olbermann and Rosie's worst nightmare would be admitting that Iran might actually be a threat. And that would be bad times.

    But apparently not tough enough to help out old Uncle Sam, who really does need some dedicated patriots to "fight them over there so we don't have to fight them over here".

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:07 AM
    Coming from someone who lied about serving himself, wow.

    Pat,
    Do you think it's possible that they are recieving money from Iran?

    Mike, hitching your wagon to Bill Maher, are you? Good luck with that.

    Posted by: Pat at April 4, 2007 1:27 AM
    Speaks volume....

    Coward Watch,
    "Because it is not a liberal press. "

    Why is the press supporting Iran?

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 1:30 AM

    The tide has turned against Bush. Our political system is based on the standard "good cop bad cop" rotation. The media is not pro-Iran the media is anti - Bush Cheney. But only to a certain degree. When Hillary becomes President she will keep the billions flowing into Iraq. Imagine if it were McCain as the next President sending hundreds of billions into Iraq, do you think this nation would stand for it? No. But if Bill and Hillary are back in the saddle they can do no wrong right? Wrong!

    You live in an ocean and all around you is water. Yet you see no water. Take your head out of your ass and look around. Get a f---ing clue. Stop surfing porn and listening to Fox Noise and Rush Limbaugh, they are 100% media whores who do the bidding of billionaires on this planet. Poor and middle class people as usual pay the price while the rich get richer.

    The media is owned by corporations not George Soros. They are about as left wing as Berry Goldwater. MSNBC has been slamming Rosie all day for her comments on 911 conspiracy. More than Fox, why do you think that is? Because Fox has no credibility with Rosie fans - MSNBC does.

    You live in fantasy world simply because you live in fear of your shadow. You suck up Fox Noise fear mongering garbage and act like a good little coward should.

    Like a brain dead idiot!

    Everybody,
    Notic how CW is scared to debate me. I've pulled his card. He claims this conflict is about oil. But when I point out the 7th century Jihad. He dissappears.
    He's the true Coward!

    Speaks volume....

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 1:47 AM

    Speaks very little. Little brain - little dick!

    Hey Keith, good night and get a life.

    Everybody,
    Notic how CW is scared to debate me. I've pulled his card. He claims this conflict is about oil. But when I point out the 7th century Jihad. He dissappears.
    He's the true Coward!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 1:48 AM

    Man you are a gem. You think you can debate me? In your dreams pea brain one.

    The Left wing media is alligned with Iran because they hate the military, they like "peace keepers". They hate conservatives more than Jihadies and Iran. They will back Iran until Hillary is elected and she can send "peace keepers" into Iran and we can have a real Vietnam.

    Coward Watch,
    Bad news. Hillary isn't winning. Rudy will win.
    He's going to neuter the media like Putin did in Russia. America needs a Putin to defeat the Islamists and Their Far Left allies.
    Heck, if Rudy becomes President don't be suprise if people like Ulbermahn start disappearing and Iran is bombed to rubble!

    If this war is about oil, why did Islam start this war when the attacked the Eastern Roman Empire in the 7th Century?
    You keep avoiding this fact, but like a true Leftist you don't know history. Hence you can't answer. Ignorance is bliss, right?

    Jeff baby, didn't you say earlier today that you were gonna start ignoring me....or was that lie number 103?

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:20 AM
    Kinda like steppin in dog sh-t, kinda hard to ignore.

    Factor,
    Did you see Nancy Pelosi wearing a Hijab. If I were the GOP I would run that add all day in 2008!

    Hey CW,
    you hate this country so much, why don't you move to Iran. That way you can hang out with your allies!

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:07 AM
    Coming from someone who lied about serving himself, wow.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 1:45 AM

    I am assuming Mike does not need to lower himself to respond to this garbage. It was a simple thing to prove that you lied RoyalKing/Jeff and was caught in that lie when you claimed you were a vet. The best you can do to recover from such a shameful act is to attack Mike who proved you a liar about serving your nation.

    Mike is a vet who can prove it, Jeff/RoyalKing is a liar about being a vet.

    Case closed!

    Factor,
    Did you see Nancy Pelosi wearing a Hijab. If I were the GOP I would run that add all day in 2008!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 1:54 AM

    She look perfect in that. I was waiting for her to get on her hands and knees and pray to Mecca. What a disgrace. If she had any guts, she would burn her braw and tell them to legalize abortion.

    Coward watch,
    You're a despicable low life. You support Iran and Islamic Jihadis.
    Obviously you're an ignorant fool when it comes to history.
    A product of our Stalinist Public School Culture you are!

    Hey Johnny Dollar, did CIA Agent Larry Johnson really say that we shouldn't fear terrorism, two months before 9/11? That seems a little too crazy to be true.

    The Factor,
    You notice the Feminists don't criticize Sharia law and the oppression of women in Islam?
    Strange alliance?

    Coward watch,
    If Iran was nuke what would you do?
    Cry?

    To Feminists, it is ok to oppress women if you are not a white christian male.

    Hey CW,
    you hate this country so much, why don't you move to Iran. That way you can hang out with your allies!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 1:57 AM

    Now you have me laughing. This is a classic response from a pencil neck pussy who never opened a book in his life to learn about the world beyond his front door.

    No I would never want to live in Iran. Life sucks there compared to here. But it won't for long if low lifes like you get your way and the Constitution is used for toilet paper.

    You are Fox News educated, I had a father who fought in war who told me how the world works. He taught me to go to church and taught me to never put my church before my country. They don't do that in Iran. They put their religion first. Thank God we don't have the bible belt hillbilly congress in power any more or we might as well be living in Iran!

    Good night Coward Watch and Mike. Rember what Reagan always said. Liberalism only works in heaven where they don't need it, and hell where they already have it.

    Coward Watching,
    Again you can't anser my qwuestion.
    If this war is about oil, why did the Muslims attack the East Roman Empire during the 7th Century Jihad?
    You are an ignorant illerate bum. A true loser. You don't know nothing about History and just keep repeating the same stuff Hillbilly, Redneck, KKK. You have no arguments and have been exposed as a fraud!
    A true Son of Stalin!

    > Hey Johnny Dollar, did CIA Agent Larry Johnson really say that we shouldn't fear terrorism, two months before 9/11? That seems a little too crazy to be true.

    But of course he did. I don't make stuff up. Who do you think I am, Keith Olbermahn? We've got a link to it in one of the writeups. He also said Bin Laden's not a real threat. A real Einstein.

    Johnny$,
    I s Coward Watch a real poster or is he a Mrs. Philby/Rudy Ramirez prank!
    He's so ignorant and stupid it's too funny! Lol!

    Coward watch,
    If Iran was nuke what would you do?
    Cry?

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:05 AM

    Hey you brain dead idiot. Iran is able to snuff it's nose at the world because of the policies of George Bush and Dickless Cheney.

    Iran is running free because a bunch of hillbillies were elected to congress back in 2000 and they went to work destroying the credibility of the USA. Today we are stuck between Iraq and a hard place thanks to fools like you rubber stamping anything the "I'm a Christian" Republican congress and "Jesus is my favorite person" Bush wanted to do. Now the world is very hesitant to trust us or back us.

    Iran is doing what it is doing because it can. How f---ing dumb do you have to be not to see it is the failures of Bush/Cheney that has made Iran so desperate and so bold? Are you totally clueless or what?

    f--- are you ever dumb!

    "But of course he did. I don't make stuff up"

    Sure you do! You like to confuse Cause and effect and call it proof.

    Johnny$,
    I s Coward Watch a real poster or is he a Mrs. Philby/Rudy Ramirez prank!
    He's so ignorant and stupid it's too funny! Lol!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:13 AM

    This what you call "debating" ?

    I thougt so. Like I said in your dreams you could ever debate me.

    In your dreams!

    CW,
    "Iran is doing what it is doing because it can. "

    It's doing what it's doing because it has the Leftist media and people like Ulbermahn, Rosie and you supporting them. Also Bush is a pussy. he lets the Media push him around. If we had a strong leader like Rudy, Iran, Iraq and Syria would be rubble right now and thge world would FEAR us!
    People like you and Ulbermahn would "disappear" or live in fear!

    Coward Watch,
    You still don't haven't explain why the Muslims launched the 7th cwentury Jihad. That's when this war began! How come Muslims have beef with every Non Islamic country around them?
    Explain that, use your Stalinist thinking.
    Can you even think?

    This what you call "debating" ?

    I thougt so. Like I said in your dreams you could ever debate me.

    In your dreams!

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 2:15 AM
    How would you fair against a 7 mag?

    If this war is about oil, why did the Muslims attack the East Roman Empire during the 7th Century Jihad?Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:10 AM


    Now this 100% redwolf talking. How do you "debate" a fool like this? You guys on the pro Fox News team have a real potpourri of support here.

    I can't even laugh anymore at how pathetic you all are.

    To Feminists, it is ok to oppress women if you are not a white christian male.

    Posted by: The Factor at April 4, 2007 2:05 AM

    Sean Hannity couldn't have said better. Even though he says it all day every day.

    Pathetic

    Coward Watch,
    " can't even laugh anymore at how pathetic you all are."

    In other words you don't know too much about the history of Islam? You don't know how it spread or their Genocidal Jihad.
    What's happening now is just the latest round of the struggle. This time, however Islam has the advantage. They have an allied Leftist press and ignorant fols like you who don't know history.
    You can't discuss this because you don't know about this.
    You's just a Stalinist fool!

    I am assuming Mike does not need to lower himself to respond to this garbage. It was a simple thing to prove that you lied RoyalKing/Jeff and was caught in that lie when you claimed you were a vet. The best you can do to recover from such a shameful act is to attack Mike who proved you a liar about serving your nation.

    Mike is a vet who can prove it, Jeff/RoyalKing is a liar about being a vet.

    Case closed!

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 1:58 AM
    When did I say I was a vet? Who's making crap up? You.

    Coward Watching ,
    Why don't the Feminists condemn Sharia law and fight for Women's equality in Islamic society? Even in this country Muslims are trying to establish Sharia law for their communities. Where are the Femimists?

    royalking,
    I'm convinced that CW is a Mrs. Philby prank.
    Remember she appeared and he disappeared. She's gone now he's here.
    Strange isn't it!

    Mister Olbermann has turned me straight.

    Coward Watch and lil mikey, together as one little coward, defending the enemy.

    It's doing what it's doing because it has the Leftist media and people like Ulbermahn, Rosie and you supporting them. Also Bush is a pussy. he lets the Media push him around. If we had a strong leader like Rudy, Iran, Iraq and Syria would be rubble right now and thge world would FEAR us!
    People like you and Ulbermahn would "disappear" or live in fear!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:17 AM

    Life is one big comic book for you isn't it. That all you ever read in prison - comic books? Heroes for the scared dickless dumb asses like you. "Rudy can save us"

    Dream on. I hope this page and you are here when Hillary becomes President and when Rudy, and somehow John McCain, couldn't make it to be President.

    The elections are fixed. Hillary was chosen years ago back when Bush we pre ordained by the corporate power structure.

    Who is that guy who has been traveling around with Bill Clinton the last 6 years? Oh yea that would be George Bush the father of W Bush.

    Get a clue you Fox News monkey.

    "Our political system is based on the standard "good cop bad cop" rotation."

    I defy anyone, anywhere to match the stupidity of our CW.

    Grammie

    royalking,
    I'm convinced that CW is a Mrs. Philby prank.
    Remember she appeared and he disappeared. She's gone now he's here.
    Strange isn't it!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:27 AM
    I think lil mikey and coward watch probably live in the same tent or trailer, they defend each others lies and bs and they love Ulbermahn.

    Coward Watch and lil mikey, together as one little coward, defending the enemy.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:29 AM

    Such sophisticated and articulate prose you pump out here Jeff. Always showing how frustrated you are, how hopeless you are in articulating an argument that has some meat to it.

    Pathetic is all I can say about you. Poor pathetic uneducated fool.

    Tell us about your father.

    Mrs. Philby aka Coward Watch,
    So why do you support Hillary if you're against the power structure?
    Also why do you support Iran?
    Hey why are you avoiding the topic of Jihad?
    As a spawn of Stalin you don't know history!

    SO Jeff, your only excuse for you being too cowardly to serve your country is to claim that I lied about having served myself? A pathetic defense....a classic red herring too!

    I certainly don't need to prove I served in the military to a cowardly liar like you. I know I served, and quite frankly, you're the only idiot on this board challenging me on it. Incidently, I have never thrown the FACT that I served in the USAF on a major base used for bombing North Vietnam during that war in anyone's face. It only came up in an incidental converstion.

    But I'll tell you what it DOES do moron...it gives me one HELL of a lot more insight into war, world politics, and International relations than you, or any of your media heros could hope to have.

    And by the way Jeff, I believe that makes this about lie number 104 for you now. You're still batting .000, but your bound to get a hit sometime out if sheer luck.

    Coward watch is the enemy within, he knows all about the muslims, he is too ashamed to admit it.

    coward watch disappears and lil mikey appears. odd.

    Royalking,
    Coward Watch/Mrs. Philby is reaqlly a Jihadist. He's part of an Al-Qaeda or Hizb'Allah sleeper cell! Notice he gets touchy about Islam. I've read that what Jihadis are doing in spreading discord is to post as Far Left bloggers and attack our system.
    I believe it.
    Johnny$ can you give the FBI CW's IP address. He's an Islamic sleeper!

    lil mikey/coward watch, when did I claim to have served in the military?

    Royalking,
    I have to disagree. Mike isn't CW. CW once accused him of being this REDwolf guy he' was obssed with.
    CW is Mrs. Philby/ Rudy Ramirez.

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:27 AM
    I think lil mikey and coward watch probably live in the same tent or trailer, they defend each others lies and bs and they love Ulbermahn.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:31 AM

    Mike rarely responds to me unless it has something to do with him that I have said. Like you he is not fond of my style.

    Jeff/Royalhick makes these claims out of pure desperation. He's got nuthin. Just little wimpy quips that reach for straws where there are none.

    I defend Mike for one reason - he is a vet and deserves my respect. The low lifes like you, Royalhick, who have to resort to lying about being a vet, have balls to defame a person who is a vet, and do so only from the security of Internet anonymity. There is no chance a pussy coward like you would dare do this public.

    No chance.

    I already requested lil mikeys hero, mrs philby be turned in to homeland security.

    Coward Watch ,
    You're not a vet. You're a Jihad supporter. Hey do you make suicide belts Ahmed?

    Royalking,
    Coward Watch/Mrs. Philby is reaqlly a Jihadist. He's part of an Al-Qaeda or Hizb'Allah sleeper cell! Notice he gets touchy about Islam. I've read that what Jihadis are doing in spreading discord is to post as Far Left bloggers and attack our system.
    I believe it.
    Johnny$ can you give the FBI CW's IP address. He's an Islamic sleeper!

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:38 AM


    Now you are living up to your name. Well done!

    I defend Mike for one reason - he is a vet and deserves my respect. The low lifes like you, Royalhick, who have to resort to lying about being a vet, have balls to defame a person who is a vet, and do so only from the security of Internet anonymity. There is no chance a pussy coward like you would dare do this public.

    No chance.

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 2:40 AM
    When did I say I was a vet, loser? lil mikey is avoiding this question, too, like he always does.

    joker, this is a different coward watch.

    Royalking,
    Coward Watch/Mrs Phibly is a prank. It's some Islamic sleeper jerk or some carpet seller in Iran.
    He's prankster. He's not serious. It's a big joke.

    I already requested lil mikeys hero, mrs philby be turned in to homeland security.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:41 AM

    More hero talk for the cowards. Always a person or crew that can be their hero to save them from the diaper heads with beards.

    You show your colors so well. They all are shades of yellow!

    "joker, this is a different coward watch."

    Nope, i's the same guy. Notice he used a Redwlf reference, a hillbilly reference and his dence of Islam.
    It's the same clown.

    coward watch appears-lil mikey disappears.

    joker, this is a different coward watch.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:44 AM

    You flatter me! And you do this while making a fool of yourself.

    So do you have a Trans Am, a Camaro, or an El Camino on cinder blocks in front of your trailer?

    Coward Watch/Mrs. Philby,
    Honestly, you post as a joke. Your a sad individual who's never amounted to anything in life. You need a hug!

    I bet lil mikey is proud to have the enemy defending his lies.

    coward watch appears-lil mikey disappears.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:49 AM

    Which says he can't stand my style and chooses not to put up with it. You seem to be haunted by the possibility that you could fall victim to a multi-named poster here.

    I wonder why that is? Could it be because you do it all the time? I think so.

    Loser!

    either one of the traitors can show me where I said I served in the military,but, they both claim I said it.

    haunted? no, amused is more like it.

    I bet lil mikey is proud to have the enemy defending his lies.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:50 AM

    Well we know who humiliates you the most. It is obvious who you are stung by more than me. Mike must be doing something right to have you so bent out of shape about him.

    You just can't hide that yellow stripe can you?

    still waiting for proof I said I served in the miltary, lil mikey or coward prick.

    I'm not bent, I'm laughing my ass off! lil mikey is the one who gets all bent, like sharon said, she thought he was having a stroke the other night, that was classic....

    Jeff's lie number 105. He just claimed that I claimed that he claimed to have served in the military. I never said anything of the kind about you...I've known all along you were too cowardly to have done that.

    However, you've lied about so many things, I'm surprised you haven't lied about that as well.

    either one of the traitors can show me where I said I served in the military,but, they both claim I said it.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:52 AM

    I have no need to dig through days and weeks of your garbage posts here to prove anything. Your stature on this page is in the eye of the beholder. You know what you are. It is my task to slap you around from time to time when you forget.

    You lie, you change your name, and you do this at the same time. This is all you got because your brains are fried.

    I wonder what happened to your so called debate. Nothing more about why Iran is able to push the USA and England around? You take that in and call Bush a wimp and fluff your feathers in fantasy speak about how Rudy would save the day if he was President.

    Too bad Rudy has no intention of being President. It is all show.

    Who but a pea brained Royalhick would accept that a war hero like John McCain could not beat a pro-choice - pro gay marriage fake Republican like Rudy?

    How screwed up is your thinking?

    If the powers that be wanted John McCain to be President and more importantly, John McCain want to be President, don't you think then that he would not be the next president?

    You live in a dream world. I wish John McCain would run, I would vote for him. Rudy? Never!

    If it came down to Hillary or McCain I would vote for McCain. He has way more stature than any of them - Democrat or Republican.

    But McCain has no intention of winning the primaries. It is all show so fools like you think we have a real democracy.

    You are gullible.

    Let's hope this page is here when Hillary is president. Then I will have great time with ignorant a--holes like you who still think that Fox News is an accurate portal on the world.

    Go on Jeff, dredge up the archives moron.

    Show me where I ever accused you of claiming that you had served?

    MORON!

    still waiting for proof I said I served in the miltary, lil mikey or coward prick.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:56 AM

    Prick? So are you saying I am mean and nasty to you? You once again show your colors - and they are all shades of yellow.

    joker, this is a different coward watch.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:44 AM

    Confusion sets in when the frustration goes up. Poor thing.

    So then it's an El Camino on blocks in front of your trailer.

    Wait I know, it's a Chevy Nova, bondo and grey primer all over.

    Yep that's it.

    Coward Watch ,
    You're not a vet. You're a Jihad supporter. Hey do you make suicide belts Ahmed?

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 2:43 AM

    I never said I was a vet. And I won't. As for committing suicide, that is for fools who suck up bull sh-t from people who feed you religion and nationalism at the same time. Kind of like the bull sh-t Fox News pumps by the hour. You the same Fox News you champion.

    Oh my God, is THIS ever the time to provide some real answers.

    For one, Joker, is that the ONLY thing you can fire back with? "Oh, what a traitor you are?" "Why don't you move to Iran?" "Why are you supporting Iran?" "How dare you say it's our fault for the British troop POWs in Iran?"

    For one, we are fighting for our freedoms, supposidly, but we're not allowed to USE them unless we agree 110% with you and the President? Isn't that what the terrorist WANT us to do? And haven't you heard about anything named the Geneva Connections? And how about that Iraq wasn't the breeding ground for terrorism until we screwed things up there royally? Are you seriously THIS willing to say ANYTHING to defend Bush?

    And just who was it that told a son of a 9/11 victim to shut up and for his producers to get him out of here before he tears him to f---ing pieces? Or how about the Shawn Hornbeck sh-t? C'mon. I thought conservatives were smarter than this.

    By the way, what exactly is Hilarly losing right now? I don't want her to win anyway (I'm for Obama right now), but still, not sure what she's trying to win right this second as we are so early.

    And I'm lost now as to what the hell we're debating about again. Remember, this is the same site that Cox cowardly removed, thinking that it was actually HELPING Olbermann's ratings (yeah, like Billo didn't help out any), the same one that is only trying to get Cox noticed in the blogosphere (HA! That ship sailed without you a LONG time ago), the same one that is breifly talked about in the press to show just what kind of garbage Cox and Dollar try to use day in and day out (no one is worried, anyway. I'm not, but it seems we have sheep).

    CW, look what blog your posting to. THAT will give you some idea.

    Seriously, Olbermann really HAS to give this site what it deserves. Same retarded people posting about how Cox and J$ are the be all, end all of the blogging world. Irritating, not because they are right (because they aren't), but because they seem to not even get their diplomas.

    I wouldn't be surprised if Fred Phelps was defended on here by them if Olby "attacked" him. They probably agree with anything Phelps says (God Hates Fags, right?).

    Hey you brain dead idiot. Iran is able to snuff it's nose at the world because of the policies of George Bush and Dickless Cheney.

    Coward,

    Is this the first time Iran pulled a stunt like this? No. Bush was not at the helm on November 4, 1979. But guess who was involved? Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. I'll take the word of the hostages who id'd him.

    Sharon,

    Yeah, we should be dealing with Iran the way Reagan did: By giving them weapons for hostages...

    I still can't comprehend the Left's support for Iran.

    What does the "yeah" mean? I just pointed out that Coward is blaming the Bush administration for a similar action that Iran committed almost 30 years ago when there was no Bush administration.

    "Yeah" is sarcastic. Essentially, Carter had the military to do something had he wanted to. Bush has squandered our military so that it cannot be used anywhere besides Iraq/Afghanistan.

    Joker,

    According to facts, it is the right who have been supporting Iran. Starting with Reagan giving them weapons and more recently Cheney selling them oil parts to improve their economy.

    Try not being so ignorant, son...

    I know the "yeah" was sarcastic. My point is that there is a difference between why something happened versus what action to take.

    blindrat,
    "According to facts, it is the right who have been supporting Iran."

    Explain why when Clinton was president he eased restrictions on Iran?
    Why did he try to deal with Iran?
    Also why does the Leftist media support Iran?
    Why on Leftwing sites is there shows of support for the Iranian regime?
    Why doesn't Leftwing human rights group that bitch about Gitmo, not complain about Iranian human rights?
    Obviously your an ignorant fool!

    Blindrat,

    I guess you missed all of the discussion the other night. Prior to the recent hostage crisis, Olbermann and Matthews repeatedly painted the Bush administration as leading our country into a war with Iran. As soon as the hostage situation occurred initiated by Iran, silence from both. You can deny that the two of them are liberal, but it would be either a dishonest or uninformed statement. Where is the condemnation?

    Silence doesn't necessarily equate with support but it lends credence to what many here believe: Olby (I'll stick to him because this is Olbermann Watch) has an agenda. He is not an impartial journalist. Will you even acknowledge the Tron fiasco?

    Now that Coward Watch has shown his true colors (profanity spewing conspiracy theorist), it makes his posts much easier to dismiss.

    Ahmadinejad "Pardons" 15 UK Sailors

    From Reuters:

    TEHRAN, Iran - Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad says he has pardoned the 15 British sailors and marines detained in the Gulf last month.

    Ahmadinejad also gave medals of honor to the Iranian coast guards who intercepted the 15 British sailors and marines in the Gulf, saying
    Iran will never accept tresspassing of its territorial waters.

    "On behalf of the great Iranian people, I want to thank the Iranian Coast Guard who courageously defended and captured those who violated their territorial waters, the president told a press conference.

    More to come.

    UPDATE:Ahmadinejehad says the pardon is "a gift to the British people":

    "On the occasion of the birthday of the great prophet (Muhammad) ... and for the occasion of the passing of Christ, I say the Islamic Republic government and the Iranian people — with all powers and legal right to put the soldiers on trial — forgave those 15," Ahmadinejad said, referring to the Muslim prophet's birthday on March 30 and the Easter season.

    The Iranian president said the sailors would be taken to the airport at the conclusion of his press conference; however other Iranian officials said they would be released to the British Embassy in Tehran. The Embassy has been the site of violent protests in the last few days, so we may not be out of the woods yet.

    Ahmadinejehad criticized the deployment of British sailor Faye Turney, who is married and has a 3-year-old child:

    "How can you justify seeing a mother away from her home, her children? Why don't they respect family values in the West?" he asked of the British government.

    above was courtesy of the jawa report.


    Sharon,

    Yeah, we should be dealing with Iran the way Reagan did: By giving them weapons for hostages...

    Posted by: blindrat at April 4, 2007 10:53 AM


    Actually, Pres. Carter offered arms as payment for hostages during the Iranian hostage crisis.


    http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,953997-2,00.html

    "Former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski confirmed in his recently published memoirs that the Carter Administration clandestinely offered to supply spare parts to Iran in return for the hostages' freedom."

    Also Carter had authorized arms sales to the anti-soviet factions in Afghanistan as the Soviets began making noises about invading.

    I just went to read the Leftist Blogs and they're cheering and praising Ahmadinejad! They're calling him a great man. I even saw a Ahmadinejad 2008 poster. It's sickening!

    "Actually, Pres. Carter offered arms as payment for hostages..."

    Typically imprecise, self-serving, and meaningless.
    Cecelia = Relativism + Partisanship + 1upmanship

    "How can you justify seeing a mother away from her home, her children? Why don't they respect family values in the West?" he asked of the British government."

    A cleverly stupid question from a scheeming thug that has been shown America's real weakness-- that we no longer strongly believe in our own liberal secular roots. A strong plurality of the right in America is incapable of answering this question, and has more in common with Islamists than secularists. Culture war indeed.

    I don't think the Constitutional framers considered pouring money into politics to be "free speech" for one second.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:26 AM

    Pouring whose money? John Q Public's money or billions from the Fortune 500?

    There is no way the framers of the Constitution would ever have approved of turning the political process they framed into process of pimps and whores as it is now. You live in a huge state of denial to not acknowledge this. And yes it is precisely because of Constitutional rights that it has come to what it is today. This was not foreseen and something should be done about it. Unless you are one of the Fortune 500 companies you would have to be a royal a--hole to not want an end to the take over of our government by huge corporations.

    You are truely anti democratic and anti-American

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 12:50 AM
    Olbyloons turning on each other, thought this was reposting!

    Tell us Cecelia, how is the fact that the Carter admin armed anti Soviet forces (in more places than you mentioned, by the way) a rejoinder to the question of whether or not we should trade arms for terrorists? What? It's not? It's just a fact you thought everyone would want to know?

    Sponge Bob Squarepants lives under the sea, you know, so I think the GAS resources should not be used in partisan electoral politics.

    VOK,
    "A cleverly stupid question from a scheeming thug that has been shown America's real weakness-- that we no longer strongly believe in our own liberal secular roots."

    If that's the case, why does the Left support Iran?

    "If that's the case, why does the Left support Iran?"

    Well, Mr. Generality, the "left supports Iran" because Iran is made up of about 70 million people the majority of whom are probably relatively pro-western. The regime there keeps power by trumping up conflict with the west. The regime here kind of benefits from this too, so there's your crisis.

    The Iranian regime can not stand to have peace with the west, because they will collapse. That is why THEY are dangerous. But the question of how you deny them the conflict they want without making them more dangerous is a thorny question that is best answered by a presidential administration other than this one. When this administration acts, Iran gets exactly what it wants. That has been proven.

    A strong plurality of the right in America is incapable of answering this question, and has more in common with Islamists than secularists. Culture war indeed.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 12:33 PM

    Aside for the usual insults instead of arguments, it is interesting to see myself described as being "relativistic in a post essentially about rightwing absolutists....


    The British hostages were taken captive while they were merely on patrol in the Persian Gult.

    I'm just wondering what "strong plurality of the right" believe that women should not serve in the military in ANY capacity whatsoever.

    I'm wondering too about the Vox's logic in arguing that America has "lost our secular roots" and is now weakened by theocrats akin to Islamic fundamentalists.

    In the very recent past far fewer people believed that a woman's place was in the military than do now. Doesn't this mean that our country is less Islamic fundamentalist...NOW?

    Doesn't it mean too that for the vast percentage of our history, our country was nothing short of what you would characterize as theocratic-dictatorial-like regime?

    Tell us Cecelia, how is the fact that the Carter admin armed anti Soviet forces (in more places than you mentioned, by the way) a rejoinder to the question of whether or not we should trade arms for terrorists? What? It's not? It's just a fact you thought everyone would want to know?

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 12:41 PM

    Absolutely, that was definitely an FYI. That it was an FYI in a discussion where Reagan was invoked as having armed future Islamic fundamentalists, might be beyond your abstract reason....but there are others who are capable of the connection.

    FYI, folks...

    Sponge Bob Squarepants lives under the sea, you know, so I think the GAS resources should not be used in partisan electoral politics.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 12:41 PM

    I'm pretty certain that I can speak for Sponge Bob by saying that we both think it would definitely be a good thing if you would help the OW environment by limiting your use of your "gas" resources...

    Tell us Cecelia, how is the fact that the Carter admin armed anti Soviet forces (in more places than you mentioned, by the way) a rejoinder to the question of whether or not we should trade arms for terrorists? What? It's not? It's just a fact you thought everyone would want to know?

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 12:41 PM

    Let me quickly point out too that the "anti-Soviet forces" that I specifically mentioned, and that VOK is hedging around, are the forces in Afghanistan. In other words, the Mujahadeen.

    VOK,
    The Left doesn't support the Iranian people. They support the regime. How come the Left doesn't discuss the human rights abuses in Iran?
    Why do Leftists like you keep making excuses for the regime.
    Why doesn't the Left support the dissidents in Iran?

    Hey did anyone see Condi Rice wearing her scarf in Afhganistan? She looked better in it that Pelosi did. Must be the conservative streak.

    Cecelia, the left doesn't want to be bothered with peanut Carter FACTS, they get really upset....then they play the "blame" card and say " It's Reagan's fault, you dummy."

    Well, Mr. Generality, the "left supports Iran" because Iran is made up of about 70 million people the majority of whom are probably relatively pro-western. The regime there keeps power by trumping up conflict with the west. The regime here kind of benefits from this too, so there's your crisis.

    The Iranian regime can not stand to have peace with the west, because they will collapse. That is why THEY are dangerous. But the question of how you deny them the conflict they want without making them more dangerous is a thorny question that is best answered by a presidential administration other than this one. When this administration acts, Iran gets exactly what it wants. That has been proven.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 12:49 PM
    Hey,looky, we have a "new" poster and he is an Iranian expert, supposedly....Tell me, why would Iran "collapse" if they were at peace with the US? Have any other countries "collapsed" who are at peace with US? "Collapsing" is self imposed.

    Jeff: "Hey,looky, we have a "new' poster and he's an Iranian expert,"

    Thats significant Jeff, because you're clearly a moron...an 'expert' in exactly nothing except mindless taunting and serial lying.

    "The British hostages were taken captive while they were merely on patrol in the Persian Gult.

    I'm just wondering what "strong plurality of the right" believe that women should not serve in the military in ANY capacity whatsoever. "

    I see the little crack you want to slip through there. Of course it requires you to add things that were never said, but what of that? So while I have no doubt that a pretty large group of Christianists would in fact like no women in the military, other than really really "female" roles like nurses and cooks and USO dancers, that Dobson organization focuses on banning women from "combat roles." That has no clear definition so it's pretty useful as a coalition builder. It allows the far right to fraternize, and vote, with the more moderate right.

    The Iranian kook's statement is really quite broad. He simply is asking how you can ship women with little babies around the world to serve in the armed forces. That's not traditional conservative behavior. A large and growing chunk of the right will agree that that is inidicative of poor "family values" or the spiritual poverty of modern times.

    So your answer is "focus on the family" people.

    Jeff: "Olbyloons turning on each other."

    Yes, Jeff, that actually IS possible with our side, because politics and truth is not about team sports the way it is for you and your side.

    That said, your 'repost' is fundamentally dishonest, as usual....because the guy clearly explained in a subsequate post that his response wasn't meant for me at all.

    VOK,
    " He simply is asking how you can ship women with little babies around the world to serve in the armed forces."

    My response is why does he support Female suicide bombers, Kid suicide bombers and brainwashing Young kids to hate all Non-Muslims?
    Of course like a good Lefty you will defend the Iranian and their Islamo-Fascist allies.

    Iran Says British Captives to Be Freed
    By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer

    1 hour ago

    TEHRAN, Iran - President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad said Iran would free the 15 detained British sailors and marines Wednesday as an Easter holiday "gift" to the British people.

    Those Damn Evil Iranians! What do they know about Easter?

    Using our own holidays against us, How Dare Them!

    "Have any other countries "collapsed" who are at peace with US?

    Sure. Soviet Union is the greatest example. The untenable regime was propped up for a while by our opposition, then when the cold war got old enough and it became clear to the populace it was no war at all, internal reform finally swept through. Tyranny depends first and foremost on external enemies. It collapses of it's own weight otherwise.

    Iran had a much stronger reform community before Bush and the total revaluation of human rights and denigration of soft power.

    As always the Lefties supporting the Iranian regime.

    "Jeff: "Olbyloons turning on each other."

    Yes, Jeff, that actually IS possible with our side, because politics and truth is not about team sports the way it is for you and your side."

    That is an interesting point Mike. The fox news nuts on this site are not interested in discovering any larger truth. They are interested in attacking anyone on the left who disagrees with them. That is why some of the (admittly few) bright Fox news nuts, will side with someone like Royal King despite knowing (as they have to) that he is a complete an total moron.

    Original Post:

    As always the Lefties supporting the Iranian regime.
    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 1:57 PM

    Translation:

    Painting other people who disagree with me as traitors helps me feel more patriotic, even though I know in my heart neither one is true.

    ©Blogosphere Translation Services LLC
    OlbermannWatch Division

    Playing Lingo Bingo with the Right Wingos Since 2000

    That said, your 'repost' is fundamentally dishonest, as usual....because the guy clearly explained in a subsequate post that his response wasn't meant for me at all.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:45 PM
    It was meant for you, the loon changed his mind after he realized it was you, he called you "un- american". I don't think the Constitutional framers considered pouring money into politics to be "free speech" for one second.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 12:26 AM

    Pouring whose money? John Q Public's money or billions from the Fortune 500?

    There is no way the framers of the Constitution would ever have approved of turning the political process they framed into process of pimps and whores as it is now. You live in a huge state of denial to not acknowledge this. And yes it is precisely because of Constitutional rights that it has come to what it is today. This was not foreseen and something should be done about it. Unless you are one of the Fortune 500 companies you would have to be a royal a--hole to not want an end to the take over of our government by huge corporations.

    You are truely anti democratic and anti-American

    Posted by: Coward Watch at April 4, 2007 12:50 AM
    It was directed at you, lil mikey....plain as day.

    "Iran had a much stronger reform community before Bush and the total revaluation of human rights and denigration of soft power."

    Well, that is how authoritarians usually seize power. You have, I'm sure, read the Goering quote on the matter.


    Silence from ole vokey.

    "Painting other people who disagree with me as traitors helps me feel more patriotic, even though I know in my heart neither one is true."

    Leftwing Loon translation:
    I'm just mad my Pro-Iran vies have been exposed!

    Yes, Jeff, that actually IS possible with our side, because politics and truth is not about team sports the way it is for you and your side.

    That said, your 'repost' is fundamentally dishonest, as usual....because the guy clearly explained in a subsequate post that his response wasn't meant for me at all.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 1:45 PM
    More hypocrisy, first it is, then it isn't. Possible or impossible? lmao

    VoK writes " see the little crack you want to slip through there. Of course it requires you to add things that were never said, but what of that? So while I have no doubt that a pretty large group of Christianists would in fact like no women in the military, other than really really "female" roles like nurses and cooks and USO dancers, that Dobson organization focuses on banning women from "combat roles." That has no clear definition so it's pretty useful as a coalition builder. It allows the far right to fraternize, and vote, with the more moderate right."

    The Iranian kook's statement is really quite broad. He simply is asking how you can ship women with little babies around the world to serve in the armed forces. That's not traditional conservative behavior. A large and growing chunk of the right will agree that that is inidicative of poor "family values" or the spiritual poverty of modern times.
    o your answer is "focus on the family" people.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 1:43 PM


    SSpeaking of "pretty useful"... how about your whole nebulous claim a large group of Christians do not want women in the military as anything but cooks in the like?

    That's a pretty "useful" assumption for you to make since that would include daughters and wives who have non-nursing technical degrees of all types in computer science, engineering, areonautics, etc and including women who have medical degrees.

    You have given your "answer" --whatever that means... as being the Focus on the Family Group and said that they don't wish women in combat roles. This "answer" of course in no way addresses your contention that we have now because of these fundies, we "lost our secular roots" since a great many more people than those who now comprise the Dobsonites, in all capacities of life, in the entire history of this country, thought it best than women not serve in combat and that they be home to raise their children. So contrary to your argument we were MORE Islamic fundamentalist in the past...and yet we have managed to be pretty darn free and unIran-like....

    Finally, I'm sure Dobson and his followers would be very grateful that you have ascribed them as weilding such vast influence on our culture as you have, but unfortunately, they were johnny-come-latelys.

    No, according to your logic the average joe of the WWII era was akin to Atta and company.

    Original Post:

    More hypocrisy, first it is, then it isn't. Possible or impossible? lmao
    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:13 PM

    Translation:

    I hope to God no one reads yesterday's thread and see how I was branded a 'Double Hypocrite' for calling someone out for misspelling a word, when I've called someone out for trying to catch misspellings. I even managed to engage in childish name calling while calling someone out for childish name calling. And it was all in the same post! I sure am glad people here have short memories just like me!

    ©Blogosphere Translation Services LLC
    OlbermannWatch Division

    A Crutch for the Mentally Handicapped Since 2000

    Sure. Soviet Union is the greatest example. The untenable regime was propped up for a while by our opposition, then when the cold war got old enough and it became clear to the populace it was no war at all, internal reform finally swept through. Tyranny depends first and foremost on external enemies. It collapses of it's own weight otherwise.

    Iran had a much stronger reform community before Bush and the total revaluation of human rights and denigration of soft power.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 1:57 PM
    Wrong, nice try, Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed, Bush blamer. Everything is Bush's fault, we know.

    get some help, lil mikey.

    lil mikey, when proven to be wrong and a hypocrite, he goes "anon".

    That is why some of the (admittly few) bright Fox news nuts, will side with someone like Royal King despite knowing (as they have to) that he is a complete an total moron.


    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 2:02 PM

    Major, this statement would be more meaningful as to your agreement with Mike's .um....novel...and logical...contention that the right is composed of automatons engaged in groupthink and that the left is comprised of free-thinking individualistis, if you specified all the bright Fox News nuts who have sided with Royalking and on what issues.

    "My response is why does he support Female suicide bombers, Kid suicide bombers and brainwashing Young kids to hate all Non-Muslims?"

    How the ?#@! should I know what some krazy Islamist nut thinks? I have a hard enough time understanding people like you, who ostensibly speak my own language?

    Of course like a good Lefty you will defend the Iranian and their Islamo-Fascist allies." Oh yes, we all just looooove mass murder. Clown.

    "Wrong, nice try, Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed, Bush blamer. Everything is Bush's fault, we know."

    Does anyone else not remember the war with Russia? My memory must be slipping.

    Original Post:

    To Feminists, it is ok to oppress women if you are not a white christian male.
    Posted by: The Factor at April 4, 2007 2:05 AM

    Translation:

    I am so jealous that Muslims get to abuse women and I don't.

    ©Blogosphere Translation Services LLC
    OlbermannWatch Division

    The Universal Translator for Expeditions to Planet Mo-Ron Since 2000

    "Major, this statement would be more meaningful as to your agreement with Mike's .um....novel...and logical...contention that the right is composed of automatons engaged in groupthink and that the left is comprised of free-thinking individualistis, if you specified all the bright Fox News nuts who have sided with Royalking and on what issues"


    I'm sorry Fatass (sorry to call you Ailes), did you mean to suggest that you disagree with Royalking on most things? I'm not sure what a 'automaton" is, so I'm a little confused.

    "Wrong, nice try, Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed"

    Yes they were.

    So where are all the Right Wingers celebrating the release of the British Sailors?

    Oh, you mean you never really cared about the Sailors?

    Oh, you just wanted to use the Sailors as a pawn for your twisted arguments?

    Oh, you just wanted another reason to Hate an Entire Country?

    You're not happy the Sailors were released. You're unhappy the incident didn't end in mass bombings...

    Iran Frees Detained British Sailors
    By NASSER KARIMI, Associated Press Writer

    1 hour ago

    TEHRAN, Iran - Iran on Wednesday freed the 15 detained British sailors and marines in what President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad called an Easter gift to the British people. Prime Minister Tony Blair said he bore "no ill will" toward the Iranian people.

    I'm sorry Fatass (sorry to call you Ailes), did you mean to suggest that you disagree with Royalking on most things? I'm not sure what a 'automaton" is, so I'm a little confused.

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 2:50 PM


    I beg to differ, Major. You're VERY confused.

    I 'm not a Fox News nut. I've watched it less than the fingers on your ...well...your's are webbed...less than the fingers on my hand and you'll have to tell me specifically what issue Royalking is advancing in order for me to tell you whether or not I agree with it.

    Craigs: "Does anyone else remember the war with Russia?"

    No Craigs, I was in my 30's and very politically tuned in, and I can assure you that there was no war with Russia, unless you were to count the Vietnam proxy war. In which the Russian's were smart enough to not actually send combat troops, unlike us.

    'm not a Fox News nut. I've watched it less than the fingers on your ...well...your's are webbed...less than the fingers on my hand and you'll have to tell me specifically what issue Royalking is advancing in order for me to tell you whether or not I agree with it.

    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 2:57 PM
    In other words, she doesn't agree with everything I say, like you implied.

    In looking up a little further, I should have guessed that Jeff was the moron that suggested that "Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed".

    Not too many others would have made an assertion that stupid.

    "I 'm not a Fox News nut."

    I don't remember naming you as such. (I for one would not randomly call someone on the right a fox news nut.) If I did that I'd be no better than many of them.

    Craigs: "Does anyone else remember the war with Russia?"

    Yeah, I remember, we sank one of their nuclear subs...

    Huh? The sub sank on it's own...?

    Oh, oops....

    Jeff AKA the moron again: "the loon changed his mind after the loon realized it was you."

    I guess this means you are finally acknowledging that CW wasn't actually me, as you kept asserting.

    MORON!

    The Right doesn't want to talk about the British being released for the exact same 'reasons' they attributed to Olbermann for not wanting to talk about it....It doesn't jive with their views.

    I've said it before, I'll say it again, in their bitter hatred of Olbermann, They have BECOME him.

    "You become what you gaze upon"
    Ancient Chinese Proverb

    Damn Commie Know-it-Alls!

    "No Craigs, I was in my 30's and very politically tuned in, and I can assure you that there was no war with Russia, unless you were to count the Vietnam proxy war."

    I'm so relieved. I was afraid somehow, I might have missed a war with what was then, the only other super power on the planet. You'd have thought it would have been in the news or something. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to conclude that jeff has been misinformed.

    Not too many others would have made an assertion that stupid.

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 3:02 PM
    Can you back that assinine statement? Or, are you just "parroting" stupidity.

    In other words, she doesn't agree with everything I say, like you implied.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 3:02 PM


    Well, for starters I don't agree with any implication that the majority of people on the left are pro-Iran, or that they are in anyway unpatriotic in the slightest. That area is the inhabited by a very small lunatic fringe.

    We both agree that Mike is a dishonest and couldn't put forth a case for central heating in Siberia, and we both know that Olbermann is a hack. But we have different as well as similar reasons for concluding both things.

    I'm wondering what issues you've espoused that I've sided with you and defended you on.

    I'm trusting that the individualistic, open-minded, free-thinkers Craigs and Mike will tell me.

    "Can you back that assinine statement? Or, are you just "parroting" stupidity."

    Yeah MIKE!! Can you prove that Brandon or The Factor wouldn't have made an equally stupid statment?

    I'm so relieved. I was afraid somehow, I might have missed a war with what was then, the only other super power on the planet. You'd have thought it would have been in the news or something. Oh well, I guess I'll just have to conclude that jeff has been misinformed.

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:09 PM
    Just because we were'nt at war means we were at peace, einstein. You better hurry up and do some googling at get back to me.

    "Can you back that asinine statement"

    I think if you are sticking with your 'assinine' assertion that there actually WAS a war nobody else remembers, you're the one that needs to provide the proof.

    MORON!

    guess this means you are finally acknowledging that CW wasn't actually me, as you kept asserting.

    MORON!

    Posted by: Mike at April 4, 2007 3:07 PM
    No, I was proving you wrong, again.

    I don't remember naming you as such. (I for one would not randomly call someone on the right a fox news nut.) If I did that I'd be no better than many of them.


    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:03 PM

    You didn't name anyone, Major. If I'm not one of the Fox News nuts who sides with Royal's arguments here, who do you mean?

    lil mikey, pushing the burdon of proof on me because he back his or ole vokey's statement, pitter patter trot trot run run run.

    "Just because we were'nt at war means we were at peace, einstein. You better hurry up and do some googling at get back to me."

    That's funny, I thought war and peace were opposites. lets see what the dictionary says:

    Peace: the normal, NONWARRING condition of a nation, group of nations, or the world.

    Gotta love that google.

    Jeff AKA moron again:

    "I was proving you wrong again"

    You have wet dreams about the day you finally "prove me wrong" about anything.

    And to think your poor horses wake up and probably think it's all about them.

    MORON!

    Peace: the normal, NONWARRING condition of a nation, group of nations, or the world.

    Gotta love that google.


    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:19 PM
    wiggle wiggle wiggle, that post doesn't mean anything. I'll put in braindead terms for you. Are we at peace with Iran right now? No. Are we at war with Iran? No. The same was true when Russia "collapsed" as you so put it.

    "You didn't name anyone, Major. If I'm not one of the Fox News nuts who sides with Royal's arguments here, who do you mean?"

    Well, if you must know there is a certain individual, who in addition to writing a nightly, something or other, in regards to keith who runs a certain other website dedicated to defending Fox news with ever fibre of his being.

    That individual has never, ever, to my knowledge condemed a rightwinger for any action on the planet. (John Dean doesn't count)

    "wiggle wiggle wiggle, that post doesn't mean anything. I'll put in braindead terms for you."

    Yes, defiing wrods is wiggling away. I admit it. I'm a wiggler.

    Damn this is really funny...and thats why it's so addictive: Jeff is chiding me for telling him that it up's to him to prove that we were in a war nobody else remembers.

    I just can't find morons like this in real life!

    Iran right now? No. Are we at war with Iran?

    No and No. Any other questions?

    Well, let's try to be a little less concrete here folks... (and VOK called me the oneupsman...)

    War:

    2. A condition of active antagonism or contention: a war of words; a price war.

    http://www.answers.com/topic/war

    By the way Jeff, 'Russia' didn't collapse...the "Soviet Union" is what collapsed.

    MORON!

    I have three better definitions:

    War:

    1. a conflict carried on by force of arms, as between nations or between parties within a nation; warfare, as by land, sea, or air.
    2. a state or period of armed hostility or active military operations: The two nations were at war with each other.
    3. a contest carried on by force of arms, as in a series of battles or campaigns: the War of 1812.

    lil mikey, the whole debate went right over your head, and the person who started it.

    "Well, let's try to be a little less concrete here folks..."

    If it was anyone but Royal King I would probably agree. I don't think abstract thinking is one of his best qualities.

    "lil mikey, the whole debate went right over your head, and the person who started it."

    Good point Jeff, (HAHAHAHA) I'm sorry, I just wanted to be the first person to ever say that.

    Well, if you must know there is a certain individual, who in addition to writing a nightly, something or other, in regards to keith who runs a certain other website dedicated to defending Fox news with ever fibre of his being.

    That individual has never, ever, to my knowledge condemed a rightwinger for any action on the planet. (John Dean doesn't count)

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:22 PM


    So Johnny Dollar is....

    " bright Fox news nuts, will side with someone like Royal King despite knowing (as they have to) that he is a complete an total moron"

    And you conclude that Johnny sides with Royal on ..some?...most?... all?...things because Johnny hasn't explicitly countered Royal.

    How's THAT for free-thinking open-mindedness... :D

    Craigs on Jeff: "I don't think abstract thinking is one of his best qualities."

    Oh....you give him credit for 'thinking' at all!

    "Have any other countries "collapsed" who are at peace with US?

    Sure. Soviet Union is the greatest example. The untenable regime was propped up for a while by our opposition, then when the cold war got old enough and it became clear to the populace it was no war at all, internal reform finally swept through. Tyranny depends first and foremost on external enemies. It collapses of it's own weight otherwise.

    Iran had a much stronger reform community before Bush and the total revaluation of human rights and denigration of soft power.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 1:57 PM
    Sure. Soviet Union is the greatest example. The untenable regime was propped up for a while by our opposition, then when the cold war got old enough and it became clear to the populace it was no war at all, internal reform finally swept through. Tyranny depends first and foremost on external enemies. It collapses of it's own weight otherwise.

    Iran had a much stronger reform community before Bush and the total revaluation of human rights and denigration of soft power.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 1:57 PM
    Wrong, nice try, Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed, Bush blamer. Everything is Bush's fault, we know.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 2:32 PM
    Did I say we were at war with the SU? No.

    Cecelia: "And you conclude that Johnny sides with Royal on ..some? ...most?... all?...things because Johnny hasn't explicitly countered Royal."

    I don't, but he would sure as hell have more cridibility if he did, and that goes for you as well.

    "Did I say we were at war with the SU? No."

    Very good Jeff, now you've finally figured out there was a difference between Russia and the Soviet Union.

    MORON!

    If it was anyone but Royal King I would probably agree. I don't think abstract thinking is one of his best qualities.

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:31 PM


    Well, he had expressly stated this "Just because we were'nt at war means we were at peace, einstein. You better hurry up and do some googling at get back to me."

    But then maybe I've overestimated YOUR abstract abilities, Major.

    lil mikey, has johnny asked me to leave? No.

    "conclude that Johnny sides with Royal on ..some?...most?... all?...things because Johnny hasn't explicitly countered Royal."

    Well, your point seems to be I have a lack of proof on the matter. I'll agree.

    It is an impression based on the fact that he has on occasion jumped in debates on the side on people such as Royal king. and he has on occasion jumped in to attack a left winger and he has never (to my knowledge) attacked somone on the right.
    If further information becomes availible, I might revise my opinion on the matter.

    These are my observations. I'm not seeking to present a case that would sway one of his admirers. It is fine with me if you remain unconvinced on the matter.


    "How's THAT for free-thinking open-mindedness... :D"

    I'm open minded to revising my hypothesis, if I see a reason to.

    Cecelia, you make excellent arguments that take advantage of every ambiguity. No one can dispute that. In this case, the ambiguity is between a static point in time and a principle.

    The United States stands for progress in individual human freedom. This is a process that we stand for, not a static state. It is the idea of the open mind, continuously growing, learning, and freeing itself. That is the liberal secular root of our nation. It always has been and hopepfully always will be. It is what caused us to work through the evils of slavery, indentured servitude, inhuman excesses of unfettered capitalism, and unequal civil rights for the sexes, races, and religious and sexual orientations. As we continually discover that we were narrow in our interpretation of the capacities and desires of humans, and of the dignity of all individuals, we reform and grow.

    I never argued the Christian right are "more" like Islamists now than the general populace was in the 50's. The comparison is alien to my way of thinking about freedom as a process. But I would not eschew that argument either. The Islamists and Christianists have something in common that Islamists and 1950's America do not. They want to roll back. That is where the Christian right and Islamic right agree, and that is what the Islamic Kook is saying. They will say things were better "before," when men and women had less personal freedom. They will make things better in their sense by taking away choices, simplifying life, and returning to tradition and institution. We say things are better now and will be better still in the future, by expanding freedom and choice for everyone.

    While "everyone" may have acted more repressed (in a static state sense) in the 50's, you won't find as sizeable a group vociferously calling for a "going back" then as now. That is what religious fundamentalism is about, a going back, or at very least, a halting. And that spirit is what motivates a good portion of the right, and it is what the Islamic radical is pointing towards. It is nothing to be ashamed of, either for you or Amedinijad. It is a very old and very respectable position. But it is a losing position. It takes short views. It is always winning battles. It is always losing wars.

    I'm open minded to revising my hypothesis, if I see a reason to.

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:43 PM


    I think you are.

    If I haven't told you I've enjoyed the hell out of you, Major, consider it said.

    Iran right now? No. Are we at war with Iran?

    No and No. Any other questions?

    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:25 PM
    I see my point flew right over your head, too. Or, you're playing the "divert" card. The latter is true, I think. Can't prove your point, just divert.

    "Well, he had expressly stated this "Just because we were'nt at war means we were at peace, einstein. You better hurry up and do some googling at get back to me."

    But then maybe I've overestimated YOUR abstract abilities, Major."

    Well given that RK was responding to someone who was clearly talking about a shooting War and not a war of words, your point kind of falls apart.

    Luckily for me i never overestimated YOUR abstract abilities.

    "If I haven't told you I've enjoyed the hell out of you, Major, consider it said."

    Oh what the hell. Ditto.

    Well given that RK was responding to someone who was clearly talking about a shooting War and not a war of words, your point kind of falls apart.

    Luckily for me i never overestimated YOUR abstract abilities.


    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:50 PM
    Putting words in my mouth? Another olbyloon trait.

    I know, you are "revising" your hypothesis, good one, slang for changing your mind in the middle of a debate after you are proven to be wrong.

    Jeff AKA moron: "Lil mikey has johnny asked me to leave?. No."

    No Jeff, cuzz Johnny's your fren. Johnny LIKES you!

    MORON!

    Who's the moron? You should try to expand your 12 word vocabulary to 13,or maybe shoot for 14, it's a stretch, I know.

    They want to roll back. That is where the Christian right and Islamic right agree, and that is what the Islamic Kook is saying. They will say things were better "before," when men and women had less personal freedom. They will make things better in their sense by taking away choices, simplifying life, and returning to tradition and institution. We say things are better now and will be better still in the future, by expanding freedom and choice for everyone.

    While "everyone" may have acted more repressed (in a static state sense) in the 50's, you won't find as sizeable a group vociferously calling for a "going back" then as now. That is what religious fundamentalism is about, a going back, or at very least, a halting. And that spirit is what motivates a good portion of the right, and it is what the Islamic radical is pointing towards. It is nothing to be ashamed of, either for you or Amedinijad. It is a very old and very respectable position. But it is a losing position. It takes short views. It is always winning battles. It is always losing wars.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 3:43 PM


    Vok,

    That's all very easy to say but you have no real indication of how "sizable" a 1950's-era group of people there was who wanted to return to any sort of traditional standard.

    We can however judge the tenuous nature of your assertions by the realities of that era. Let's take for instance the number of people in this country who opposed desegregation in the '60s. The majority, VOK. Are we to assume that there would have been less of a majority in the '50s.

    The problem lies with the generalizations that you are making. Is segregation wrong... yes, indeed.... is it fascistic....yes, a case can be made for that...but only an extremist would then argue that our country or culture wass fascistic in nature.

    Is it wrong...on the same order of opposing segregation...to believe that women don't belong in combat....or that they should make every effort to stay at home and raise their children.... only an extremist would come to such a conclusion.

    I don't think you are an extremist. However, Iam correct when I say that you use extremist rhetoric in drawing comparisions between some of your political opponents and Islamic fanatics.

    "I know, you are "revising" your hypothesis, good one, slang for changing your mind in the middle of a debate after you are proven to be wrong."

    Well luckily for me, you've never proved anyone wrong. That means I can safely stay... stuck in my ways.


    Well gotta go for a while RK, It was fun playing with you.


    Well given that RK was responding to someone who was clearly talking about a shooting War and not a war of words, your point kind of falls apart.

    Luckily for me i never overestimated YOUR abstract abilities.


    Posted by: craigs at April 4, 2007 3:50 PM


    No, he was disagreeing Vok's apparent assertion that outside pressure hampers the collapse of tryannical regimes because they collapse under their own weight and that this is what happened with the Soviet Union-- with no help from the U.S.

    So the diaper-wearing astronut Olby fan is stll posting away I see. Of course, as usual, her "facts" don't add up nor do her posts make any logical sense, things that never get in the way of Olbermann and his cult-like followers, the Galpals.

    "Wrong, nice try, Russia was not at peace with us when they collapsed"

    Yes they were.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 2:52 PM
    If I said the sun is out right now, you would probably say, "no it's not," then go hide, like you did here.

    So the diaper-wearing astronut Olby fan is stll posting away I see. Of course, as usual, her "facts" don't add up nor do her posts make any logical sense, things that never get in the way of Olbermann and his cult-like followers, the Galpals.

    Posted by: Brandon at April 4, 2007 4:23 PM
    Who are you refering to?

    "The problem lies with the generalizations that you are making. Is segregation wrong... yes, indeed.... is it fascistic....yes, a case can be made for that...but only an extremist would then argue that our country or culture wass fascistic in nature."

    O.K....did I make that argument? If I did I disclaim it now. I don't think I did. I was trying to make almost the opposite argument.

    "Is it wrong...on the same order of opposing segregation...to believe that women don't belong in combat...."

    I don't believe it is "wrong" (morally) to believe anything. People can't really help what they believe. What is wrong in the sense of American values is to support civil laws that limit other's freedoms because of a particular vision of society that you happen to like or your religion happens to compell. Surely majorities have attempted to do this in the past and even succeeded for short periods of time. But in doing so they were working against our founding principles.

    That is what is wrong with marching FOR segregation, and what is wrong with joining lobbying groups that seek to establish prohibitions on females in combat roles. It's un-American in the primal sense. As an aside, I think females can be excellent combatants. Perhaps they can even lend something on the battlefield that would makes us much stronger in modern conflicts. As a main point, and more importantly, they have the right to contribute and sacrifice just as men do if they want. That follows as the day does the night from our American faith.

    I don't think my argument has anything to do with the 50's or any other particular point in time. I am not comforted if I am a bigot that there were more or bigger bigots before me. I want to know how I am doing wrong and how I can amend that. That was my original point.

    This point-in-time stuff is alien to my line of thinking. You think it doesn't support my point and I generally agree. But if you want to force it on my ledger, I'll tell you in what way it could fit there. Conservatives of all stripes want to either shy away (moderates) or go back (radicals.) The latter is truly what Amedinijad represents in his tradition as well. This is not extremist rhetoric on my part, it only sounds extremist if you don't understand that Amedinijad represents something that is in its own way and within its own context respectable. Just like it was respectable to flay black people before it wasn't. It doesn't make it right, but it does make it in some sense Right (conservative). The United States is the radical hippie trying to force a culture of drugs, sex, and rock-n-roll on fine upstanding Iran. Amedinijad is playing on the saliance of that image in his cleverly stupid conservative statement. And I guarantee that point does resonate in a certain part of the right. Maybe not when it comes directly out of his mouth--that's too shocking. But in principle, it does.

    "If I said the sun is out right now, you would probably say, "no it's not," then go hide, like you did here."

    No I wouldn't. There is just little more to say. We were at peace with the Soviets when they collapsed. The only thing that can come of a disagreement here is some niggling little wordplay, so forget it. I'm not interested.

    "O.K....did I make that argument? If I did I disclaim it now. I don't think I did. I was trying to make almost the opposite argumentPosted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 4:54 I hear some back peddling.....at least he is kinda honest.

    No I wouldn't. There is just little more to say. We were at peace with the Soviets when they collapsed. The only thing that can come of a disagreement here is some niggling little wordplay, so forget it. I'm not interested.

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 5:07 PM
    Face it, we were not at peace at the time you are talking about and you can't prove otherwise. I will let it go, though.

    "So where are all the Right Wingers celebrating the release of the British Sailors?"


    I am happy the sailors were released. But they shouldn't have been kidnapped in the 1st place!
    I'm not shocked at how the Left is praising Iran and congratulating Ahmadinejad as he's some peace maker.
    I guess denying the holocaust and having a conference on it is ok.


    VOK,
    Again like a true Leftist making every excuse for the Iranian regime.

    Leave it to the left to praise Ahmadinejad for releasing hostages. He would not need to release hostages if he would not have kidnapped them. Apologizing for dictators is a specialty of the left. They bash their own country and praise tyrants and terrorists.

    The Factor,
    That's what Teheran Keith will do tonight. Praise Ahmadinejad.

    "Again like a true Leftist making every excuse for the Iranian regime."

    Ah, where would that be, exactly. No no, sorry forget it. My mistake. I see now. Sorry. Sorry. You're Right. I forgot when you can't read everything says the same thing.

    I wonder how long it will take the media to figure out that when Ahmadinejad said he release the hostages as gift to honor the passing of Christ, he ment Easter. Ahmadinejad better watch his step using the "C" word. That might make the left think he is a religous zelot.

    VOK,
    "The United States is the radical hippie trying to force a culture of drugs, sex, and rock-n-roll on fine upstanding Iran. "

    Making exuses for the Iranian regime.
    Hey what's the excuse for Ahmadinejad hosting a holocaust debial conference?
    Whats the Left's rationale for that?

    Vok writes "I don't believe it is "wrong" (morally) to believe anything. People can't really help what they believe. What is wrong in the sense of American values is to support civil laws that limit other's freedoms because of a particular vision of society that you happen to like or your religion happens to compell. Surely majorities have attempted to do this in the past and even succeeded for short periods of time. But in doing so they were working against our founding principles."

    ------------------------------------------------

    Cecelia sez "Well, of course we have always limited all sorts of rights based upon our moral codes. The examples are pretty straight forward such as not allowing polygamy, individuals selling their own organs, or the sale of any representation of sex acts involving children, even if the dipictations are cartoon drawings. There are even laws in California concerning smoking on your own property and community mandates forcing citizens to recycle. These are laws that uphold their own particular world view with a particular morality dictated by that world view.

    There are other less straight forward examples of imposing moral dictates upon individuals such as laws prohibiting certain choices business owners can make concerning their own property such as laws preventing discrimination in hiring and housing. Each of these laws is predicated on a prevailing morality that such individual restrictions are proper.

    The distinctions are of course made based upon what we think is best for the whole society, but even THAT is predicated on some moral system that we are using to restrict the natural rights of property owners, etc.

    --------------------------------------------------

    Vok writes: That is what is wrong with marching FOR segregation, and what is wrong with joining lobbying groups that seek to establish prohibitions on females in combat roles.

    _______________________________________


    Cecelia sez: No, it makes no sense when you fail to make distinctions between segregationists and those who would adhere to the traditional standard of not allow women in combat. There is an argument that can be rooted in the realities of biology in the case of the latter, as well.

    But to the main point, you might as well compare champions of Sunday Blue Laws with KKK members and in the case of your argument, suicide bombers.

    -----------------------------------------------

    VOK writes "It's un-American in the primal sense. As an aside, I think females can be excellent combatants. Perhaps they can even lend something on the battlefield that would makes us much stronger in modern conflicts. As a main point, and more importantly, they have the right to contribute and sacrifice just as men do if they want. That follows as the day does the night from our American faith."

    ----------------------------------------------

    Cecelia sez --As an aside, I agree with you, completely. But it's interesting that you're making an argument based upon a moral appeal that is beyond the pragmatic and delves into some abstract area such as that of faith. You say women might bring a certain...well what to the battlefield?...a certain jenesais?.....

    A case against women in combat can be made using the realities of biology. The physical abilities for the vast majority of women are different from those of males. While physical ability is not the soul asset of a good soldier, it is a primary one and standards for male and female recruits are different.

    -----------------------------------------------

    Vok writes "I don't think my argument has anything to do with the 50's or any other particular point in time. I am not comforted if I am a bigot that there were more or bigger bigots before me. I want to know how I am doing wrong and how I can amend that. That was my original point.

    This point-in-time stuff is alien to my line of thinking. You think it doesn't support my point and I generally agree. But if you want to force it on my ledger, I'll tell you in what way it could fit there. Conservatives of all stripes want to either shy away (moderates) or go back (radicals.) The latter is truly what Amedinijad represents in his tradition as well. This is not extremist rhetoric on my part, it only sounds extremist if you don't understand that Amedinijad represents something that is in its own way and within its own context respectable. Just like it was respectable to flay black people before it wasn't. It doesn't make it right, but it does make it in some sense Right (conservative). The United States is the radical hippie trying to force a culture of drugs, sex, and rock-n-roll on fine upstanding Iran. Amedinijad is playing on the saliance of that image in his cleverly stupid conservative statement. And I guarantee that point does resonate in a certain part of the right. Maybe not when it comes directly out of his mouth--that's too shocking. But in principle, it does.

    ----------------------------------------------

    Well, let me , not too seriously , remind you that lots of drugs in the U.S. too.... :D
    and that evidently you've never heard Christian rock...

    I don't know what to tell you other than that you need to look at your sense of perspective. All appeals aren't fanatical in nature simply because they are based upon traditional moral values anymore than all desires are selfish because they are based upon an appeal toward the self.

    You'd certainly be less pesimisstic about the state of our culture now and the state of your opponents if you were more delighted that each faction in this country has the right to agitate for their ideas and to put them forth within the political process.

    You'd certainly never mistake James Dobson, or Carrie Nation for Bin Laden.

    2. A condition of active antagonism or contention: a war of words; a price war.

    http://www.answers.com/topic/war
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 3:25 PM

    I guess according to Cecelia's definition we are 'at war' with just about the entire world.

    Bush:

    If you are not 'with us' on the war on terror, you are 'against us'...

    Quick someone name me all the countries that are fighting alongside us in Iraq.

    Everyone else, we are 'at war' with.

    Antagonistic indeed!

    Iraq is still the focal point on the 'war on terror' isn't it?

    Or has that changed recently?

    You'd certainly never mistake James Dobson, or Carrie Nation for Bin Laden.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 5:54 PM

    Of course not, Bin Laden's the one with a towel on his head!

    Joker, the left is playing right into Ahmedidajihadists little blood stained hands, he's got their number on speed dial. He turns the hostages loose and they say "see, he's such a nice fellow, he just wanted to feed them and take their pictures."

    I guess according to Cecelia's definition we are 'at war' with just about the entire world.

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 6:05 PM


    No, my words were confined within a discussion about whether Royal meant Cold War tactics vs. actual military action against the USSR.

    I'm not going to go too deep into your first statement which is essentially "there have to be some laws." Yes. Of course. The point is that the laws should aim at the maximum of human freedom. Not a particular social structure, maximal freedom. Freedoms clash, and that is where the laws need to make judgements. But they are not promoting a vision of society. We judge that child pornography seriously endangers defenseless children, polygamy destabilizes society, and so forth. We judge that this will destroy freedom more than promote it.

    This is the question of the aim of the laws. If the aim of keeping women from combat roles is that it endangers the nation, that is one thing. I think that is a stupid argument loaded with old dumb prejudices, but it would be on the right grounds. If you argue that women or male gays have no place in combat or the military in the society you prefer, that is a totally different argument. What grounds is Dobson arguing on? What grounds were the Gay Arabic translators the army fired let go on?

    "Well, let me , not too seriously , remind you that lots of drugs in the U.S. too.... :D
    and that evidently you've never heard Christian rock..."

    Ha. Don't I wish. That is nasty stuff. The Christian rock I mean.

    "All appeals aren't fanatical in nature simply because they are based upon traditional moral values anymore than all desires are selfish because they are based upon an appeal toward the self."

    Of course they aren't "fanatical." I just said that. I don't think Dobbsians are neccessarily fanatical, nor is Iranian conservatism especially "fanatical." There are bomb weilders in both contingents, but they do not characterize the whole. I don't think the slaveholders were by and large "fanatical." That's what I'm saying. That isn't the issue or the accusation. You don't have to be fanatical to be wrong in the sense of going against America's founding values. They are radical conservatives, in the sense that they do not want cautious advance or even status quo, they want a retreat on individual rights. That is simply not what America is about IMO.

    I guess according to Cecelia's definition we are 'at war' with just about the entire world.

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 6:05 PM

    No, my words were confined within a discussion about whether Royal meant Cold War tactics vs. actual military action against the USSR.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 6:21 PM

    Oh, but that's where you're wrong, Cecelia...

    Sometimes during a debate we bring up facts and figures to make a point....

    And sometimes we make an unintended point.

    Which is exactly what you did.

    Having your definition fit one argument and not another is the true definition of wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

    Sometimes your arguments have unintended consequences. You should take a look at them. They might broaden your horizon and broaden your definitions...

    If your definition of war is accurate, how is my assertion wrong?

    Original Post:

    Joker, the left is playing right into Ahmedidajihadists little blood stained hands, he's got their number on speed dial. He turns the hostages loose and they say "see, he's such a nice fellow, he just wanted to feed them and take their pictures."
    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 6:20 PM

    Translation:

    I was only using the Sailors as a Political Pawn to prove my point. And even though Iran has decided to not use them as a political pawn any longer, I will continue to do so for as long as I can get away with it. I am beyond the pale. How can I live with myself?

    ©Blogosphere Translation Services LLC
    OlbermannWatch Division

    Truth Serum for the Honesty Challenged Since 2000

    "You'd certainly never mistake James Dobson, or Carrie Nation for Bin Laden."

    No. Nor Timothy McVeigh. And why can't we come up with an Iranian example here? Bin Laden is a Saudi.

    This is the question of the aim of the laws. If the aim of keeping women from combat roles is that it endangers the nation, that is one thing. I think that is a stupid argument loaded with old dumb prejudices, but it would be on the right grounds. If you argue that women or male gays have no place in combat or the military in the society you prefer, that is a totally different argument. What grounds is Dobson arguing on? What grounds were the Gay Arabic translators the army fired let go on?

    Posted by: VOK at April 4, 2007 6:52 PM


    For the same reason you give for our not allowing group marriage between consenting adults. They believe it destablilizes the family unit and society as a whole.

    You don't have to agree with them. You don't have to join 'em. But you do need to disagree with them while realizing that to those who favor open marriage between numbers of consenting adults ...or to those who think that some child pornography laws border on criminalizing thought.... *you're the cat standing in the way of progress and individual rights...

    You know the Jonestown Kool-Aid Drinkers started out as just a bunch of kooky Christians and look what happened.

    And Cecelia, before you jump all over me, yes, jonestown was the exception not the rule when it comes to kooky Christians, but it still serves as a cautionary tale about religious extremism here and abroad...

    Oh, but that's where you're wrong, Cecelia...

    Sometimes during a debate we bring up facts and figures to make a point....

    And sometimes we make an unintended point.

    Which is exactly what you did.

    Having your definition fit one argument and not another is the true definition of wanting to have your cake and eat it too.

    Sometimes your arguments have unintended consequences. You should take a look at them. They might broaden your horizon and broaden your definitions...

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 6:52 PM


    If you'll actually read the progression of the argument instead of just wanting to dispute me, einstein, you'll see that I advocated what you would call a "broad" definition of a term.

    That term was "war". You remember THAT term don't you? It's the one you narrowly defined in your first post in order to question my logic.

    That term was "war". You remember THAT term don't you? It's the one you narrowly defined in your first post in order to question my logic.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 7:24 PM

    I wasn't narrowly defining it, I was using a definition hand-picked by you...

    If you want to use your 'definition no.2' of war to describe the relationship between the US and the USSR during the 80's, fine.

    I am choosing to also use war 'definition no.2' to describe our relationship today with most of the world, through Bush's eyes.

    How am I wrong?

    No. Nor Timothy McVeigh. And why can't we come up with an Iranian example here? Bin Laden is a Saudi.

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 7:03 PM


    If you had bothered to read, you'd know there was an Iranian example.

    Yes, Cecelia, the term 'war' can have several connotations, all of them can be 'right' depending on the context.

    If you are 'right' about your application, then so am I.

    And no, not everyone who's smarter than you is an Einstein, but I appreciate the compliment...

    :D

    I wasn't narrowly defining it, I was using a definition hand-picked by you...

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 7:26 PM


    Nope you said I was narrowly defining a term....something....when I was in fact doing the opposite.


    The same of another anonymous poster writes:

    I am choosing to also use war 'definition no.2' to describe our relationship today with most of the world, through Bush's eyes.

    How am I wrong?

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 7:29 PM

    If you're saying that the U.S. is engaged in the equivalent of a Cold War with the rest of the world. Yeah, you're overstating the tensions that have developed between Bush and other western nations concerning the Iraq War.

    That's a degree argument. You're right that there are immense tensions now since Bush has been in office.

    And no, not everyone who's smarter than you is an Einstein, but I appreciate the compliment...

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 7:33 PM


    That's what makes you an einstein.

    That's what makes you an einstein.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 7:48 PM

    Interesting how you can attempt sarcasm, but don't recognize it when others use it... :D

    I was merely Ironically responding in Kind...

    That's a degree argument. You're right that there are immense tensions now since Bush has been in office.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 7:46 PM

    It took a while, but now you're starting to get it...

    It took a while, but now you're starting to get it...

    Posted by: at April 4, 2007 7:57 PM


    Oh good.

    Okay, I'm calling Bull-sh-t (As Usual)

    You say I narrowly defined 'War':

    >That term was "war". You remember THAT term don't you? It's the one you narrowly defined in your first post in order to question my logic.
    Posted by: Cecelia at April 4, 2007 7:24 PM

    Then you say I said you narrowly defined it:

    >Nope you said I was narrowly defining a term....something....when I was in fact doing the opposite.

    I did neither. Can you copy and paste where I did either of those things. Perhaps you 'thought' I 'felt' those things. But how about we stick to what people actually say, Okay?

    What I DID do was use a PARTICULAR definition, brought up by YOU, to make a point I KNEW you would have a hard time agreeing with because of your PARTICULAR views. Not ASSUMED views. But ACTUAL views expressed on this message board.

    You caved by saying it's a matter of degrees, okay, fair enough.

    But don't say I said things I didn't say.

    That's a poor way to debate anyone.

    Going to be interesting to see if Ulbermahn will mention the hostages being released. Interesting, also, how they were stripped of their military uniforms and forced to wear "borat" looking suits.

    Cecelia takes too long to respond cuz she's busy running her posts through spell check...

    I gotta go....

    I'll catch you all tonight...

    Uh oh, there's those "all caps" words from an "anon." All too familiar. I see high blood pressure coming on, maybe a stroke?

    Hey what's the excuse for Ahmadinejad hosting a holocaust debial conference?
    Whats the Left's rationale for that?

    Posted by: The Joker at April 4, 2007 5:53 PM

    You keep asking the same question and it keeps getting answered. You know it well by now but I will humor you and post it again so you can pretend your pint sized brain just heard it for the first time.

    Iran's in your face boldness is an attempt to show Israel and the USA that they are not intimidated by the huge military bases being built in Iraq right on their boarder.

    Fact is Iran is scared sh-tless. The United States now spends more of it's tax payers money on it's military than all other nations combined spend on theirs.

    Iran knows the time to have a show down with the USA is when the USA is tied down in it's operation to turn Iraq into a filling station for your 350 hp Ford pick up with monster wheels and skoal bumper sticker.

    How f---ing stupid do you have to be to keep asking this question over and over?

    The answer is simple, you are living in fear of dark people, just like your father and his father before him. As long as you live in fear you keep asking the same question as though it will make your fears go away.

    Cowards don't learn very easy do they?

    Going to be interesting to see if Ulbermahn will mention the hostages being released. Interesting, also, how they were stripped of their military uniforms and forced to wear "borat" looking suits.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 8:10 PM

    Keep watching you might learn something. Unlike your father ever did.

    joker, your making lil mikey very upset, he's, again, resorted to "anon" and "watching cowards", is he typing while looking in the mirror?

    nice try mikey, run along and get lubed up for your hero, ulbermahn.

    nice try mikey, run along and get lubed up for your hero, ulbermahn.

    Posted by: royalking at April 4, 2007 8:20 PM

    come now baiting is for fishing expeditions.

    You can hope it is only Mike slapping your pussy ass around this page but that is pure fantasy on your part.

    Time try again.

    Time try again.

    Posted by: Slapping Cowards at April 4, 2007 8:32 PM
    you're not sly lil mikey, I know you'll come back as lil mikey after you wash the lube off of yourself to see all the lies and bs Johnny has caught your hero in that you "don't defend." Saying, "see I leave for 5 minutes and jeff is accusing me of being everybody else", not everybody else, just the obvious posts that are clearly you. You can run but you can't hide, lil mikey.

    Jeff you are haunted by your own practices. You multipost all the time and so you assume others are doing to you.

    poor thing. You are what you project onto the world.

    Living in fear is an aspect of racism. You hate what you fear. You fear what you hate.

    When a dog smells fear he attacks. Why? because fears that he will be attacked first.

    This is how Fox News and CNN and all the other mass media manipulate simpletons like you. The show you men from far away places who are angry (they too convert fear to hate just like you) and you go into your "what about Iran" frenzy. Like Iran is China or Russia.

    Iran is a tiny little back water and you want to believe they are hiding behind your trailer in your parents backyard.

    It must be hell being as stupid as you are.

    Now I am off to run some errands. You can stand your post here as gate keeper of the page and maybe you will feel safe but both Mike and I will return to slap you around a little more later on.

    And while we are gone try to think what others see in your constant reference to "lube" and watching men on television.

    Very telling about just what sits all excited in the fore front of that pint sized brain of yours.

    "heads in the sand" ripped right from the puffington post blog.

    "nice try mikey".

    Wow, I just found out I've been posting again using other names! I don't believe I've ever run into this kind of sheer stupidity before.

    Jeff, I Understand why you're a Bush fan! He's a moron....YOU'RE a moron! He's a serial liar....YOU'RE a serial liar! He continually makes a fool of himself....YOU continually make a fool of yourself.

    It's all very clear. You couldn't make this stuff up.

    MORON!

    Very telling about just what sits all excited in the fore front of that pint sized brain of yours.

    Posted by: Coward Watching at April 4, 2007 9:02 PM
    very telling in what a real coward and psychopath you really are, making up posters to defend you. "we will both be back." Can't wait for you "both" or all "three" of your loony personalities to be back.

    Was I right or was I right? I was right.....

    RK, MIKEY AND COWIE WOWIE both coming after you at the same time. Poor little lambs.

    Oh, I shudder to think of the carnage you will heap upon them.

    Grammie

    Oh, I shudder to think of the carnage you will heap upon them.

    Grammie

    Posted by: Janet Hawkins at April 4, 2007 11:32 PM
    LOL! I'm shakin' in my boots!

    Actually Janet, You just shudder to think. Period.

    Grammie's High Ground:
    (...or is Grammie just High?)

    >When's the last time you got arrested after being butt f---ed?
    Posted by: Rico at January 14, 2007 6:55 PM

    >Rico, come on. That last comment was beneath you and out of line. Remember, slicing with a scapel is more painful than bludgeoning with a broadaxe. It also gives you the high ground, which by right, is ours anyway.
    Janet Hawkins
    AKA Grammie
    Posted by: Janet Hawkins at January 14, 2007 7:07 PM

    "For the same reason you give for our not allowing group marriage between consenting adults. They believe it destablilizes the family unit and society as a whole."

    I suppose I have to add a corrolary to the point that to avoid being subject to this charge of un-American activities, the argument they are making has to be not only aiming at individual freedom, but sincerely held and have some logical basis. Child pornography can quite reasonably be assumed to endanger children. It isn't the "thought crime," it is the physical crime of forcing children into sexual exploits, which is addressed on both the demand and supply side, like drugs. The civil authority doesn't care what you "think," it cares that your actions either directly or secondarily endanger children. Polygamy creates demographic and legal problems, a point I hope we can take as given to avoid getting remedial. Can you cite similar drawbacks to gay marriage? Can anyone? Do they really even try?

    Whistling dixie about individual freedom with a bible hidden behind your back doesn't cut it for me. You will say I cannot be a mind reader and know these people's complete motivation. True. But when an argument makes no logical sense, AND it happens to coincide with sectarian beliefs that these same people say are a higher law than the civil law, I can put two and two together if they say they are only concerned about practical civil matters.

    This is the case for Dobson and equal civil rights for homosexuals. I've yet to hear the cogent explanation of how homosexual civil rights "weakens" heterosexual marriages. It simply doesn't in any logical sense. It is taken as a given--because these people believe it was given, by god, in their sacred text. The word "sanctity" is worked into every other sentence, however "civil" and "secular" the venue and debate. Shall we check into the language of the painfully careful Dobson on these points, who is trying to provide you just the room for ambiguity of motivation that you are running with here? Shall we check the deliberately less-careful Bush? I doubt you really disagree on this but go ahead and surprise me.

    You may say that they think anything we do with which their god disagrees weakens "society as a whole." Fine. But then are they really so far from theocracy in this regard as you seem to want to suggest? The Iranian theocrats base all of their oppression of gays and women on the notion that allowing them equal freedoms would "weaken their society as a whole." This is simply not an American argument. And again, there is a similar strain of thought here, not in degree, but in kind.

    Actually Janet, You just shudder to think. Period.

    Posted by: at April 5, 2007 2:36 AM
    A disgruntled olbyloon......

    Grammie's High Ground:
    (...or is Grammie just High?)

    >When's the last time you got arrested after being butt f---ed?
    Posted by: Rico at January 14, 2007 6:55 PM

    >Rico, come on. That last comment was beneath you and out of line. Remember, slicing with a scapel is more painful than bludgeoning with a broadaxe. It also gives you the high ground, which by right, is ours anyway.
    Janet Hawkins
    AKA Grammie
    Posted by: Janet Hawkins at January 14, 2007 7:07 PM

    Posted by: at April 5, 2007 2:58 AM
    lil mikey making "pointless" cut and pastes.LMAO. Yes, he is a disgruntled loon, for sure.

    To bring that post back to where it started, that similar strain of thought in the U.S. is what Amedinijad is trying to call on as a brother in arms. Ultimately, I think this is the ground that the Iranian regime will try to make it's peace with the U.S. upon. If the last decade or so were America's real trajectory rather than a weird temporary backlash, it might work. But news of liberalism's death and "conservatism's" ascendancy was in fact greatly exaggerated. It has given regimes like Iran many victories, from the legitimization of torture, forced confession, and kangaroo justice, to the restriction of human rights and the rehabilitation of the concept of "spiritually guided" civil authority. But we'll dry out sooner or later and return to championing America's traditional liberal values.

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