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    Olbermann Watch, "persecuting" Keith since 2004


    May 22, 2007
    Countdown with Keith Olbermann - May 22, 2007

    "COUNTDOWN WITH KEITH OLBERMANN" (8:00 P.M.-9:00 P.M. ET)

    Host: Keith Olbermann

    Topics/Guests:

    • IRAQ: Howard Fineman, Newsweek senior Washington correspondent and MSNBC political analyst
    • SECOND SURGE: Paul Rieckhoff, Iraq & Afghanistan Veterans of America
    • GONZOGATE: David Shuster, MSNBC
    • 2008 ELECTION: Chris Cillizza, washingtonpost.com political reporter
    • REV. FALWELL AND PARIS HILTION: Jeffrey Ross, comedian


    BREAKING NEWS: Democrats Drop Troop Pullout Dates From Iraq Bill

    WASHINGTON, May 22 - Congressional Democrats relented today on their insistence that a war spending measure sought by President Bush also set a date for withdrawing troops from Iraq. The decision to back down, described by senior lawmakers and aides, was a wrenching reversal for some Democrats, who saw their election triumph as a call to force an end to the war. A Democratic effort to include timelines prompted Mr. Bush's veto of the original bill last month, producing a political impasse.

    Be still my heart, Keith Olbermann is actually saying that the Democrats caved to President Bush: "how the hell is anything if the President can just waive the benchmarks". Of course, this is pretty easy to do when they've had their hat handed to them by Bush. No wonder the Dems hate Karl Rove so much. Keith says he's "stretching" to say the Democrats won. Keith calls it a "Democratic collapse".

    And June 3rd is FAST APPROACHING.

    Story #5: Iraq - Keith calls Dem collapse a "disaster" and "betrayal". Even Paul Rieckhoff has to admit the President framed the debate and got what he wanted.

    Story #4: Gonzales - whoops, the vote of no-confidence on Monday, then Tuesday, is not unlikely before the Memorial Day weekend. Where IS Keith getting his information. Ah! Right on cue....here comes Slippery Shuster, fresh off his stakeout of the DC Courthouse where he's still lurking in anticipation of Karl Rove's indictment by Patrick Fitzgerald.

    Oddball - Keith proves the Loch Ness monster could not possible be real. Keith then addresses his day off last night saying "I've been off, big whoop, wanna fight about it?" Also, drunks at horse race, cat stuck in a carpet.

    Newsmakers - Chinese weather machine, jet lag treatment, high-tech underpants.

    #3: Campaign 2008 - McCain curses, makes a snide comment about Romney, Guiliani in 3rd place in Iowa, Edwards leading Dems in Iowa.

    Chris Cillizza - Edwards leading because he "never left" Iowa. Guiliani has to follow the game plan from 2000 and 2004 by going to Iowa, then New Hampshire, then South Carolina even though the entire primary season has been drastically remade. Independent campaigns? Bloomberg?

    Top 3 Bites: Bush joking around, stuck ducks, Paula Abdul tripped and injured.

    #2: Dog Bites Kid - Determined to remedy the hit his image took last week for laughing when a young child was kicked in the head, sending her flipping through the air and landing face first on concrete, Keith feigns concern over another child attacked by dog as he sets up a canned piece from NBC News.

    Keeping Tabs - Porn star pays homage to Katie Holmes by taking the name "Katee Holmes", Oprah's dad, Vernon Winfrey is writing a book and Oprah's not happy, Paris Hilton on a list of heiresses,

    WPIW - dumb crook, Bill O'Reilly, Limbaugh (with the added note that Keith was listening to Rush while sitting in the toilet...nice!)

    #1: Paris Hilton - carrying a bible, going to jail, blah, blah, blah.


    Posted by Robert Cox | Permalink | Comments (201) | | View blog reactions

    201 Comments

    I added the "breaking news" because MSNBC sent out the show briefing before the news came that the Democrats blinked on the Iraq funding bill. There may not be enough time for Keith to get all the new Dem talking points into the opening spiel so look for the high points lifted straight from Harry Reid's comments at the presser an hour ago.

    Democrats "blinked", Coxy ?

    Working WITH the POTUS is something of anathema to Republicans.
    You and your right wing buddies have your rallying cry: Party over country!

    Actually Fineman just used the word "cave" to describe the Democrats today and Olby didn't correct him to point out how it was bad for Bush.

    The question of the night: will Michelle Malkin beat Olbermann by more than a 2-1 margin?

    Sox up on Yanks 3-0 as "Countdown" starts. Keith no doubt has Yes on one of his monitors to keep track of the game as the show goes on, so he'll be in a fouler mood than usual even without the Dems' cave-in on the Iraq funding bill if the score doesn't change.

    Olby's including a story about a child who was attacked by a pit bull. Do you think he's feeling the sting (of his bosses) after laughing about the little girl who was kicked in the face and landed head-first onto concrete?

    Olby Watch prevails again.

    8:13, you and your surrender monkey Defeatocrat pals are so bitter.

    These dimes are usually dropped on Friday...about 6 pm. Man that had to hurt. Immigration is next. Harry always looks so sad these days....I hope he has been practicing his back peddling at the gym lately, wouldn't want to pull a hammy.

    Viagra Keith. Now you can fly despite your "medical condition." (Tonight's #2 Oddball).

    So much for Bush being irrelevant.

    Did we expect any more from Nancy Pelosi and her band of Commie do-nothings? Of course not. She was more popular in Syria. I think she should buy a one-way ticket for her next tactless Middle East visit. At this point, the lefties are so miffed at the Dem Congress that they probably would pay for it. They got what Moveon.org paid for.

    Slow news night huh Keith?

    But a dog attack story followed by Paris Hilton? Um, yeah, Ok. (I) Don't get it but OK. You're telling me there was NOTHING else out there?

    I log out early tonight and watch Colbert on TIVO.

    Oh, one last thing -- sorry everyone.

    Mr. Keith Olbermann WAY TOO MUCH INFORMATION with that toilet story. (Vomit). Please don't make me look at your face and tell me your potty story (vomit). Oh, excuse me. (Wipe mouth). It's just I ... (vomit).

    Oh no, Robert, what ever you do, get the "blinked" comment in there. mickey mouse will have something to cry about for the next 6 months. Shit, he's still crying about the last one!

    So much for Bush being irrelevant.

    Posted by: Robert Cox at May 22, 2007 9:29 PM

    "Bush is irrelevant" and "has lost his credibility" is a direct quote from the deplorable one a week or so ago.

    Good thing there weren't any pretzels involved:

    Bush's Seat Belt Usage Not Locked Down
    By BEN FELLER, Associated Press Writer

    2 hours ago

    WASHINGTON - President Bush encourages people to wear seat belts. Whether he routinely does so himself is not as clear. The question arose Tuesday, Bush's first full day back in town after a weekend at his ranch in Texas _ where he was spotted driving a pickup truck without wearing a seat belt.

    The timing comes just as Bush's government is sending the opposite message. This week marks the launch of law enforcement's annual seat belt campaign, known as "Click It or Ticket."

    In his morning briefing with reporters, White House press secretary Tony Snow was asked whether Bush wears his safety belt while riding in his armored limousine.

    "Does he wear a seat belt in the limo?" Snow said in some disbelief. "I don't know."

    After starting to field a question on another subject, Snow stopped to amend his answer.

    "Let me just back up," Snow said. "I have seen him wear it in the limo. I'm not going to give you a report card because my ventures in the limo are relatively rare."

    Later, in his afternoon briefing, Snow was asked again to clarify Bush's personal policy.

    "Well, it's always important to wear seat belts, especially when driving slowly on the ranch," Snow said.

    He seemed to emphasize that Bush was driving slowly when he had no seat belt on.

    At the time, Bush was in his truck, pulling away from a pool of reporters who had come to watch him greet the NATO secretary-general and his wife.

    "But I think it's, in point of fact, something that _ we encourage everybody to wear their seat belts," Snow added.

    Citing security reasons, Snow wouldn't comment on whether the Secret Service requires Bush to wear a seat belt.

    "The Secret Service, I guarantee you, looks after the president and is absolutely determined to ensure his safety in every way possible," Snow said.

    Seat belt use came into national focus last month when New Jersey Gov. Jon S. Corzine sustained severe injuries during a crash. He later apologized for not wearing a seat belt.

    Regular seat belt use is the single most effective way to protect people and reduce fatalities in motor vehicle crashes, according to the government.

    And Bush not wearing seatbelts has got to do what exactly with the Democrats caving (yet again)?

    How could O'Reilly get a 'WPIW' nomination when he's on vacation all this week? And for what exactly?

    For breathing?


    I wrote my own Countdown episode summary. I read your description. I think I could do better. Unlike last time, I am not doing it to spite the siteholder. This time, I am just doing it for curiosity. NOt because I think you are inferior, Robert Cox. Do not take it that way.

    The Iraq compromise. Benchmarks waved? "2nd Surge". "Gonzo-Gate". Another joke. Goodling. John McCain outrages. Pit Bulls. Partis Hilton's Bible. Rush Limbaugh. Let's begin.

    Issue #5: "Sereptitious help". Bush needs to be heald "accountable" for freeing the world from Saddam Hussein. War funded through September. Pelosi not likely to vote. Howard Fineman talks Texas Hold 'em. Mature indeed. The Democrats folded. A "back & forth through the Summer is required" which reminds me why politics is just so wastefull. Fine knows that Ron Emanuel does not believe more idle threats circulated around Captial Hill (which is why I h8 politics.) Raum Emanuel called the "beginning of the end of Bush's war in Iraq". Remember that around November 2008. "The Democratic Congress was elected to curb the war in Iraq." No, they were elected to impeach the President (Hee hee hee!) BONUS!: "Liebermann's clout" was blurbed. "Bush has already won." snarls an angry Finestein.

    General Riecoff chimes in. Footage of the troop axeing a door down. Keith Olbermann cites "Catch 22". The troops are happy they've got their money.

    Issue #4: MONICA GOODLING. "Document dump" results from Alberto Gonzales wake. David Schuster. David Eglesias was "pressured" to give endictments. The email was the response to a "stonewall". Senator Pryor was refused for Tim Griffin. Imagine that.

    Keith Olbermann amazingly puts something in context. "(We do not have a canned editorial response.)" was for a specific column and not necessarily for the whole Democratic shabang. Surprised? Wait & see... I also think that when Slippery said the Congress is "trying" fo "illegal wiretapping" proceedures he literally meant "trying".

    Newsbreakers: The Chinese's weather controlling machine is turning out to mean "cloud seeding". Shhot. Rats should be tested for a low dose, not a high dose of Viagra.

    Issue #3: McCain pulls a "Chenney". Chris Cillizza John Kerry won in 2004. John Edwards still maintains hisIowa appeal from it? 4 years later? Come on! Democrats have "given away the store." on funding. That is two defeatist comments from the party of defeat this early in the political games. John Edwards texted Chris Cillizza shortly before Countdown. HA! BONUS!: Bloomberg's run. Bloomberg "wants t think that he is winning." I want to think about turning the channel from this subconscious bias. Although it gets better...

    Issue #2: There are 5 million dog bites a year, and 1 out of 5 of them are children. This is what I learned from the canned programming that was played on Countdown.

    W.P.I.T.W.: Blue Blog Source goes to Media Matters for Silver Bill O' Rielly. Personally, I thought that this item was weak. Only two examples given. Gold goes to Rush Limbaugh, Blue Blog Source: Countdown! More deserving than Rush Limbaugh is Keith Olbermann for AGREEING with Bill O' Rielly.

    Issue #1: I forget. I am still reeling over Keith Olbermann agreeing with Bill O' Rielly and calling him "buddy". This is the equivalant of me making friends with E.Schatz. That ain't going to happen.

    Paul Rieckoff is not a general and it's predictable that the most poignant points of the show , which were made by Rieckoff, got barely a mention by Obama Watch Him (avoid the truth)

    What a partisan hack !

    Was calling P. Rieckoff a general supposed to be an attempt at humor, or are you really that uninformed ?

    You're not good enough to clean Paul's toilet !

    Noneame:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/paul-rieckhoff/better-late-than-never-a_b_33683.html

    Read that. If you ask me, General Paul Riekhoff is more protestor than general these days. If you ask me, him and Countdown are joined at the hip, for sure!

    If you ask me, him and Countdown are joined at the hip, for sure!
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 22, 2007 11:14 PM

    Which would make both of them correct now wouldn't it.
    Please refute a single point of Rieckoff's or shut the f#ck up.

    After graduating from Amherst College in 1998 with a degree in Political Science, Rieckhoff coached high school football, worked on Wall Street, participated in the rescue efforts at Ground Zero on 9/11, and served as an infantry platoon leader in Iraq from 2003-2004. In the spring of 2004, Rieckhoff became one of the first Iraq veterans to publicly criticize the war and demand accountability from elected officials.

    He is a regular commentator on TV and radio and recent appearances include: ABC's This Week with George Stephanopoulos, CNN's Paula Zahn Now, Anderson Cooper 360, Fox's Hannity and Colmes, and MSNBC’s Hardball with Chris Matthews. In November 2004, Rieckhoff was honored by Esquire magazine as one of “America’s Best and Brightest for 2004” and was interviewed Tom Brokaw on The NBC Nightly News.

    Rieckhoff has also had opinion pieces printed by AlterNet, Knight-Ridder and the International Herald Tribune and has been featured in The New York Times, Washington Post, L.A. Times, Army Times, Wall Street Journal, Reuters, New York Daily News, Newsday and A.P.

    Now Obama Watch Him Twitch, post YOUR resume.

    I already wrote everything that I disagree with. If Lt. Maj. Paul Rieckhoff said anything substantive to either me or anyone else out there, they would not need to show the troops break a door down with an axe. They are showing that for subconscious vigilance against the troops, you know.

    Rieckhoff was honored by Esquire magazine as one of “America’s Best and Brightest for 2004”

    Obama Watch Him Cringe have been voted one of George Bush's largest stool specimens.

    Why should Obama "post his resume" when you won't even post with a user name?

    My biography: None of your information.

    However, I do not appear on Countdown to undermine the troops overseas by whining about nonissues of the government for the left. There is a difference.

    Brandon has a lot of questions but not a single friggin answer.

    Whenever you have nothing to say, it's always the "no Name" obsession, instead of debating what people say.

    Could you be more shallow ?

    If Lt. Maj. Paul Rieckhoff said anything substantive to either me or anyone else out there, they would not need to show the troops break a door down with an axe. They are showing that for subconscious vigilance against the troops, you know.
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 22, 2007 11:21 PM

    Subconscious vigilance against the troops !
    You think the leader of the largest Vet Group in the country would agree with that?

    You got nothing.

    I love it when the cowardly chickenhawks come on this site and dare criticize heroes and knowledgable people like Paul Rieckhoff !

    If I had to choose thee most repellant form of propaganda on the tube, it would come down to Raffah the Mouse and the MSNBC b-roll. There is nothing more than the citings of troops being malicious or things on fire, and it is an afront to the troops that are there.

    As I've posted on this board before (many times), I knew the war in Iraq would be a mistake. I said it then, I know it now and I've never changed my position on it. These people have been fighting one another since time began and they'll be fighting one another when the world ends. It's the history of that region of the world. Furthermore, the connection to Osama was never firmly established in my mind. I've always been highly suspicious of the motives for truly going to war with Iraq. But we're there now. And we're going to be there for years to come. There is no easy exit strategy and if there was don't you think the Dems would have come up with one instead of doing what they're doing right now? That's the political reality of it. It's the only reality of it. You can quote all the military experts you want. I've never maintained the war is going well, I know it's not. So I'm not sure what you want out of me. Just remember, while you're trying to assign blame to the Republicans the Democrats were right with them every step of the way and from the latest, still are. So why are you pissed with me? The blame here can be shared by BOTH parties. That's the reality.

    As I said, refute a single of Rieckhoff's points, or shut the f#ck up.

    Anon at 11:26 "...instead of debating what people say. Could you be more shallow ?"

    Only if he was pulling out biographical information (and harassing others for their qualifications)... ;-)

    The blame is not EQUAL in both parties.
    Never has been. This is still Bush's war.
    The GOP Congress never had the slightest shred of oversight or accountability for the 6 years they ruled.
    The Democrats ( most of them) are least against this war and attempting accountability but they don't have the votes to FORCE bush's hand.

    That is not EQUAL blame.

    Good night.

    noname: Why am I talking to you? You said what again? That I should clean Rieckhoff's toilet?

    Hmmm. Has Cecelia decided to start leaving anonymous comments now? I've addressed The Anonymous Ones "points" above. They want answers now on this war and there are no easy solutions, despite the pablum they were fed and eagerly ate by the likes of Olbermann and the Democratic party. Now the Dems have shown their true colors. What else will they default on? You people are so quick to point your finger at the Republicans but you don't exactly have a stable full of prize winners yourself. And remember, the Republicans were backed by the Democrats every single step of the way on this war and every aspect of it up to and including today. Deal with it sucker.

    noname: Why am I talking to you? You said what again? That I should clean Rieckhoff's toilet?
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 22, 2007 11:45 PM

    Incorrect. I said you're not GOOD enough to clean his toilet.

    You're not 1/100 the man he is.

    Ya, Obama, you can stop cleaning Rieckhoff'f toilet now...

    The Democrats voted for this war. That's a fact. The Democrats are now in charge. So where's the accountability they promised? Where are the timetables? You have no answers for that though do you?

    and on that, GOOD NIGHT to you! No Name!

    The Democrats voted for this war. That's a fact. The Democrats are now in charge. So where's the accountability they promised? Where are the timetables? You have no answers for that though do you?

    and on that, GOOD NIGHT to you! No Name!

    I am not 1/100 the man that Paul Rieckhoff is if I am talking to you, noname.

    The crazies seem to be out tonight. I did not know that these things fell under left or right, but they seem to do.


    "You people are so quick to point your finger at the Republicans but you don't exactly have a stable full of prize winners yourself."

    Brandon wins the prize for the line of the day. I needed a good laugh. How bout that Mad Man Murtha? Non barker on Planet Olby.


    Rep. John Murtha (D-Pa.) submitted an earmark certification letter for the National Drug Intelligence Center (NDIC) May 1, more than five weeks after the Intelligence Committee’s deadline and the day before the panel marked up its authorization bill, according to copies of the letter and the notice of the deadline sent to the entire committee.
    Murtha addressed the letter only to Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes (D-Texas), not Rep. Pete Hoekstra (R-Mich.), the panel’s ranking member. Hoekstra has said he was not given a copy—an apparent violation of House rules. All earmarks must be disclosed in writing to both the chairman and ranking member.



    #1: Paris Hilton - carrying a bible, going to jail, blah, blah, blah.

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    Ohh doody! Robert Cox is on the side of the people that lowercase the words "Bible" and "God". Dang. (yikes!!!!!) Whenever I am reading a book that has God or the Bible not in capitals ... I get scared. Usually I am more repulsed by God not getting capitalized. Darn. I didn't know R.Cox was apart of the crowd --- gulp!!!!!

    Hey, RK, you're my bitch. 'Nuff said.

    Move over , Nick. He's MY bitch !

    Looks like the media is in love with Paul Rieckhoff. Gee, I wonder why. Could it be because he's a Bush hating liberal? And I wonder what would happen if the media was to present an oppossing view point to Paul Rieckhoff. Wait, I do know. That oppossing view point would be permanently banned from that network. Even if that network is funded by tax payers.

    And I wonder what would happen if the media was to present an oppossing view point to Paul Rieckhoff.


    Hasn't happened yet dumbass.
    Guess why?
    Because he knows what's going on.
    And he fully supports his brothers in the military.
    That you call a Bush hating liberal.
    All that comment did was make you look like a fool!
    Might have worked in 2002, but not anymore.

    Uh...James, I dont know if you heard, but General Batiste...yeah, he got fired for talking against Bush on his VoteVets ad. So, i dont know what you're talking about, but its quite the other way. Nice try though.

    And Anon, cant we share him, hes enough of a bitch to go around to at least two of us.

    Go ahead. Put Hannity, Rush, savage. ANy of the chickenhawks up against Paul Rieckhoff, someone who's actually been there and is a huge troops advocate.
    Put it on Pay For View.
    I'd love to see it.

    Noname has a crush on Paul Rieckhoff.

    No one told James that his tired old ways are not convincing anyone anymore. Just the opposite.
    Most of the country knows Bush has been a unmitigated disaster.

    NO Name is smart enough to listen to people who know the truth.Someone who isn't corrupted by partisan politics.
    What's your excuse ?

    Obama still has not come up with a single contradictory point to offset anything Rieckhoff has said.
    Wonder why.
    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

    How much of his own money has Reikhoff given to the troops or to defense teams defending our own troops for doing what they were paid to do?

    Noname is >>> litterally

    Paul Rieckoff is not a general and it's predictable that the most poignant points of the show , which were made by Rieckoff, got barely a mention by Obama Watch Him (avoid the truth)

    What a partisan hack !
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:08 PM

    Was calling P. Rieckoff a general supposed to be an attempt at humor, or are you really that uninformed ?

    You're not good enough to clean Paul's toilet !

    Please refute a single point of Rieckoff's or shut the f#ck up.
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:16 PM

    After graduating from Amherst College in 1998 with a degree in Political Science, Rieckhoff coached high school football, worked on Wall Street, participated in the rescue efforts at Ground Zero on 9/11, and served as an infantry platoon leader in Iraq from 2003-2004. In the spring of 2004, Rieckhoff became one of the first Iraq veterans to publicly criticize the war and demand accountability from elected officials.

    He is a regular commentator on TV and radio and recent appearances include: ABC's This Week with George Stephanopoulos, CNN's Paula Zahn Now, Anderson Cooper 360, Fox's Hannity and Colmes, and MSNBC’s Hardball with Chris Matthews. In November 2004, Rieckhoff was honored by Esquire magazine as one of “America’s Best and Brightest for 2004” and was interviewed Tom Brokaw on The NBC Nightly News.

    Rieckhoff has also had opinion pieces printed by AlterNet, Knight-Ridder and the International Herald Tribune and has been featured in The New York Times, Washington Post, L.A. Times, Army Times, Wall Street Journal, Reuters, New York Daily News, Newsday and A.P.

    Now Obama Watch Him Twitch, post YOUR resume.
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:19 PM

    Rieckhoff was honored by Esquire magazine as one of “America’s Best and Brightest for 2004”

    I love it when the cowardly chickenhawks come on this site and dare criticize heroes and knowledgable people like Paul Rieckhoff !
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:33 PM

    As I said, refute a single of Rieckhoff's points, or shut the f#ck up.
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:39 PM

    noname: Why am I talking to you? You said what again? That I should clean Rieckhoff's toilet?
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 22, 2007 11:45 PM

    Incorrect. I said you're not GOOD enough to clean his toilet.

    You're not 1/100 the man he is.
    Posted by: at May 22, 2007 11:48 PM

    And I wonder what would happen if the media was to present an oppossing view point to Paul Rieckhoff.


    Hasn't happened yet dumbass.
    Guess why?
    Because he knows what's going on.
    And he fully supports his brothers in the military.
    That you call a Bush hating liberal.
    All that comment did was make you look like a fool!
    Might have worked in 2002, but not anymore.
    Posted by: at May 23, 2007 12:36 AM

    Go ahead. Put Hannity, Rush, savage. ANy of the chickenhawks up against Paul Rieckhoff, someone who's actually been there and is a huge troops advocate.
    Put it on Pay For View.
    I'd love to see it.
    Posted by: at May 23, 2007 12:38 AM

    NBC's Jim Miklaszewski reports on how the Bush administration pays the Pakistani government $1 billion a year to hunt down Osama bin Laden, and demands zero accountability as to how that money is spent.

    In a long line of unfuckingbelieveable misdeeds and bonehead moves by Bush, this is just another little one.

    So if I understand this correctly, we are paying Musharraf $1 billion a year to strike immunity deals with the warlords thought to be harboring this man we're paying him to catch? This is appalling on so many levels. Given the huge sum of money we're paying this man to implement policies that are counterproductive to our national security and yield few results, how can we possibly consider him our "strong friend and ally"?

    Instead of learning something on the internet, this late at night or reading a book, Obama watch Him Make a Fool of Himself has nothing better to do than to rewrite some of my posts.

    Still waiting for you to come up with someone, anyone that has BETTER information than Rieckhoff.
    It's always so funny that the people who have all the creds are the ones that you wingnuts diss.
    Would you rather believe the lying 4 deferments Cheney, AWOL Bush or war hero Paul Rieckhoff ?
    Like I've said, You got nothing.

    Defend this: post something that is fair 'n' promotionary to the Bush administration, then we will talk.

    Fair?
    The truth is fair.

    m —New Republic>
    - fair·ness noun
    synonyms FAIR, JUST, EQUITABLE, IMPARTIAL, UNBIASED, DISPASSIONATE, OBJECTIVE mean free from favor toward either or any side. FAIR implies an elimination of one's own feelings, prejudices, and desires so as to achieve a proper balance of conflicting interests . JUST implies an exact following of a standard of what is right and proper . EQUITABLE implies a less rigorous standard than JUST and usually suggests equal treatment of all concerned . IMPARTIAL stresses an absence of favor or prejudice . UNBIASED implies even more strongly an absence of all prejudice . DISPASSIONATE suggests freedom from the influence of strong feeling and often implies cool or even cold judgment . OBJECTIVE stresses a tendency to view events or persons as apart from oneself and one's own interest or feelings . synonym see in addition BEAUTIFUL

    Pronunciation Key

    © 2001 by Merriam-Webster, Incorporated
    Merriam-Webster Privacy Policy

    BovineQueen posts another non-sequitur:

    ---
    How much of his own money has Reikhoff given to the troops or to defense teams defending our own troops for doing what they were paid to do?
    Posted by: royalking at May 23, 2007 12:48 AM
    ---

    Bovine, you are a total moron trying to nit pick on Rieckhoff. Just go ahead, call him "traitor" and start swift boating anyone associated in anyway with www.votevets.org

    moron BUSHWIPES!

    "On May 1, 2004, in a spot normally reserved for Governors and Senators, Rieckhoff delivered the Democratic Response to President Bush's national weekly radio address."

    Pauly, in a nutshell.

    Plus there is no such word as "promotionary".
    Nor does anyone have to stretch the truth even a little to condemn George W. Bush.

    BovineQueen posts another non-sequitur:

    ---
    How much of his own money has Reikhoff given to the troops or to defense teams defending our own troops for doing what they were paid to do?
    Posted by: royalking at May 23, 2007 12:48 AM
    ---

    Bovine, you are a total moron trying to nit pick on Rieckhoff. Just go ahead, call him "traitor" and start swift boating anyone associated in anyway with www.votevets.org

    moron BUSHWIPES!

    BovineQueen posts another non-sequitur:

    ---
    How much of his own money has Reikhoff given to the troops or to defense teams defending our own troops for doing what they were paid to do?
    Posted by: royalking at May 23, 2007 12:48 AM
    ---

    Bovine, you are a total moron trying to nit pick on Rieckhoff. Just go ahead, call him "traitor" and start swift boating anyone associated in anyway with www.votevets.org

    moron BUSHWIPES!

    noname: My Countdown summation was fair. I gave Keith Olbermann credit for putting something in context & when he agreed with Bill O' Rielly.

    A.A.P.: You should not have said who "Bovine" was. Now that I know who "Bovine" is, it is not going to be nearly as much fun to catch you embaress yourself!

    "On May 1, 2004, in a spot normally reserved for Governors and Senators, Rieckhoff delivered the Democratic Response to President Bush's national weekly radio address."

    Pauly, in a nutshell.
    Posted by: royalking at May 23, 2007 1:08 AM

    Who could possibly be a better spokesperson and know more about how poorly Bush has mangled this war, than someone who has fought in it, and been an advocate for the troops?

    Michale Savage?
    Rush Limbaugh?
    Any of your heroes?

    LMAO

    The Royalfraud thinks that if he can associate anyone with the democratic party or AP, or HUFFPO, it's a putdown.
    All it does is make you look like a fool !

    Notice the Royalfraud and the Obama fraud can't argue anything against Rieckhoff on merit or information,
    They can only attack him by association.

    Lame. real lame.

    let me quote Bob's post tonite.

    Speaking of spineless....
    That would be every single republican at this site who would gleefully jump on the democrats for this bill but never speak the truth about the Iraq War or their president.
    Not one of them would ever discuss the conditions that Paul Rieckoff spoke of tonight. He is more of an expert on the iraq war than anyone at this site or any talking head or journalist we listen to on a daily basis.
    Paul is a veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom and the Executive Director and Founder of IAVA (Iraq & Afghanistan Veterans of America), the country's first and largest Iraq Veterans group.
    He spoke of the tremendous hardships Bush's surge is having on the military.When soldiers are ready to end their tours, Bush pulls the carpet from them like Lucy pulling up the football for C. Brown, and extends their tours.This is decimating morale and stretching our military to the breaking point.
    Divorces are skyrocketing among our military families and suicides are occuring when they come home with their inability to cope with their memories of combat. They are not getting the psychological help from the military or from the Department of Veterans Affairs.
    BTW, the Bush administration also plans to cut funding for veterans’ health care two years from now... even as badly wounded troops returning from Iraq could overwhelm the system. Even though the cost of providing medical care to veterans has been growing rapidly.. by more than 10 percent in many years... White House budget documents assume consecutive cutbacks in 2009 and 2010 and a freeze thereafter.
    Back to Rieckoff...he also noted it doesn't matter how many brigades Bush sends to Iraq, b/c a military solution is not going to solve the Iraqi problem w/o diplomacy and other countries involved with the process.
    Rieckoff has said that Bush could send 3 times the amount of troops he's sending now, and it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

    So who are you going to believe ? The jingoistic OLBYhaters at this site, especially Cee, or an expert like Paul Rieckoff, someone who knows what he's talking about and has walked the walk !

    I was too busy getting the information on the episode to actually listen to anything that the weasel Rieckhoff was saying. Sorry. He is a coward if he appears on Countdown, we know.

    OWUBFT sez:

    ---
    A.A.P.: You should not have said who "Bovine" was. Now that I know who "Bovine" is, it is not going to be nearly as much fun to catch you embaress yourself!
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 1:14 AM
    ---

    What? You have been around here for a while and you didn't know who Bovine is?

    I knew I would eventually get in trouble with Robert, but all along I've been saying, and I repeat once more:

    Whatever you do Bob, *do not get rid of BovineQueen*


    weasel?
    coward?
    This war hero is a weasel and a coward ?

    Nice rebuttal.

    You are an idiot.

    Noname; Yes sir ree, pal. Rieckhoff is a coward and a weasel. Not mearly for criticizing the president, not for all of his Veteran's services, & not just because he was on Countdown. He is a coward and a seditious traitor for feeing Keith OLbermann's hate full, vile embellishments against the troops during a time of war. It does not matter how much time you have served. What matters is the time that the troops are serving and the job they are doing. Rieckhoff is making the troops' stay longer and their propblems more violent by feeding the left's games. There.

    As I was sayin'

    ...(Bovine, you are a)

    total morons trying to nit pick on Rieckhoff. Just go ahead, call him "traitor" and start swift boating anyone associated in anyway with www.votevets.org

    Didn't take long! moron BUSHWIPES!

    Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor showed us his true colors tonight.

    If this is the opposition in 08', I'd say the Democrats are a lock to win !

    One last thing before I head out of here.

    OWUBFT has not come up with a single verifiable fact to counter anything P Rieckhoff has said tonite or any other night.
    Just call him names.

    Pathetic and embarrassing.

    Noname: I am fervently upset with the antiwar left that keeps on pulling for a pull out. I have always expressed that mentality an I continue on that in my daily monologues on this website and continue to point out E.Schatz's failures, being correct and fair, and point out the commentators that are out of ideas and have to make a big deal about everything, like this one character, Paul Rieckoff.

    Rieckhoff is making the troops' stay longer and their propblems more violent by feeding the left's games. There.
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 1:32 AM

    The troops #1 advocate is making them stay longer. Not George Bush.

    Again. You are an idiot.

    Isn't it funny how the right wingers SAY they support the troops, until one of them actually speak out on what is happening, then they;re weasels and cowards.

    Glad you finally "opened' up on how you really felt, Obama.
    You appeared so much smarter when you were just goofing around.
    Now you left all doubt what an ignorant, traitor you are to the USA.
    Party over country!
    YOU are the weasel.

    Wow, Obama. You really are an idiot. What on Olbermann's show is hateful or a vile embellishment against the troops? Wanna talk against the troops? What man who "supports the troops" would honestly help destroy one of the nations best Army Hospitals(privitization of walter reed), not give our soldiers enough armor, extend their stays, decrease their off-time, then after all this he refuses to give them a pay raise? And Rickhoff is a coward and a weasel. I think you're getting Paul and King George mixed up. And I'm pretty sure that "noname" got you back there, you've had nothing to say against Paul Rieckhoff's arguments. You've only tried to attack his character through insults and false statements. I knew the right wing was full of moranic hate-mongerers (im looking at you, Bitch(RK)), but dear lord you're pretty bad.

    What do you think of these brilliant pieces?!?:

    ---> "Global Warming" is either Earth's normal, natural systems or the End Times. No human envolvement what so ever.

    ---> Walmart is thee most successfull business venture ever and the reason that Liberals hate Walmart is because it reminds them about how successfull the United States is & they dispise this nation.

    ---> Talking can not make peace, especially in the Middle East.

    ---> New Agers wish they were living in the year 1500.

    ---> Abortions are a Liberal's best friend.

    Katie, Katee, Katy.

    This site is so refreshing and educational to see so many people that are deluded, ignorant and refuse to acknowledge the facts about this war.

    You wonder how they can keep such a closed mind and shut off anything that contradicts their world views.
    Our forefathers warned us against citizens like Obama who are "blind patriots".
    He is anything BUT a good American, who not only should question their leaders, but have a duty to question them.
    Listen to Obama when he says how pissed he is about the people who criticize the president and the "anti war left"..which makes up around 70% of the US now.
    Obama is so yesterday.He is part of a dying breed who were one of the original flag wavers that bought into Bush's war fever and still support his failed policies.
    As I said, a true patriot doesn't put party over country .
    OBama Watch Him Wither is dying on the vine !

    Now you left all doubt what an ignorant, traitor you are to the USA.

    ---------------------------------------------------------------

    Why is it that someone who wants the troops to succeed in Iraq is (aformentioned)? I am rooting for them. People like Keith Olbermann, Paul Rieckhoff, and Jimmy Carter want to keep on using the public's perception of the war (negative negative negative) as their missile head against the Conservatives and they want the troops out for no good reason (bad reasons: because the war is not "winning", because the war is not "good" because we had no "reason" to be there...) when we all know that the troops want to finnish up and I for one like the benchmark idea, but my goodness ... the left are trying to make Bush look bad for political purposes.

    Oh My God. OWUBIT is a global Warming denier too,
    He sure has drunk the Kool Aid with the whole right wing package.

    For one, Im pretty sure you just ignored everything I said, and noname has said and went off your own way to hate on liberals. What do they call that, ya know, that thing where you try to avoid the point...Oh yeah, spinning. Nice. You're an idiot for your view on Global Warming. And Walmart is hated because it takes advantage of small nations by outsourcing their labor at super-cheap prices. We despise it because it embodies the way that America is heading: We will be a nation of out-sourced contracts. We wont do anything for ourselves, and only those who own the businesses will be able to live here because the rest of us wont have jobs. Except to serve the bigwigs. Talking sure cant hurt, whether it will work or not is unknown, we didnt try it, we just attacked. What the hell does the new ager thing mean? And Abortions are a woman in a horrible situations best friend. Not a liberals. Now, did you see what I did there? I took your arguments and argued my view against them. Its called a debate, try it.

    OWUBFT sez:

    ---
    Yes sir ree, pal. Rieckhoff is a coward and a weasel. Not mearly for criticizing the president, not for all of his Veteran's services, & not just because he was on Countdown.

    He (Rieckhoff) is a coward and a seditious traitor.
    ---

    OWUBFT, let me introduce you to Bovine.

    Ooooh Bwwwovine! Meet OWUBFT, another fascist chicken-hawk in the same barn as you.

    I'll let you two girls play with the dictionary and find more words to smear the troops. "weasel,
    coward, seditious traitor" are already on the list.

    Here are two more hints, but be careful!
    these are really, really bad names to call someone: "Dem..." and "Lib..."

    Noname posted at: 1:55 a.m. --- Nothing I have said was at all with a micron of anger in it. I am sure that Paul Rieckhoff is a tremendous guy. Just do not give a whine whine whin whiner the keys to any war. Whiners can not succeed. Not the whiners that want the troops out of Iraq before there is a measure of stability. Not before we have made sure that no terrorist cells are in Iraq. Not until we have secured the nation of Iraq to a better state. Keep philosophizing about how awful Bush is. He looks like a guy that is trying to succeed against the threat of terrorism depite a bunch of hippies that forgot that the 60s ended a while back.

    Obama, Im pretty sure you're avoiding the point. Yeah, you are. Have you tried thinking lately? And there werent really terrorist cells in Iraq before we got there...we kind of caused that.

    Obama, Im pretty sure you're avoiding the point. Yeah, you are. Have you tried thinking lately? And there werent really terrorist cells in Iraq before we got there...we kind of caused that.

    Obama, Im pretty sure you're avoiding the point. Yeah, you are. Have you tried thinking lately? And there werent really terrorist cells in Iraq before we got there...we kind of caused that.

    And Walmart is hated because it takes advantage of small nations by outsourcing their labor at super-cheap prices.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Nick: Where is the outrage against Nancy Pelosi's little shell game with small below-equator islands? Remember when she used it to her advantage to avoid a taxes? She is a powerful Liberal and we never heard about that again, now have we ?!?

    STOP THE PRESSES!!!

    ---
    Yes sir ree, pal. Rieckhoff is a coward and a weasel. Not mearly for criticizing the president, not for all of his Veteran's services, & not just because he was on Countdown.

    He (Rieckhoff) is a coward and a seditious traitor.

    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 1:32 AM

    ---

    I am sure that Paul Rieckhoff is a tremendous guy. Just do not give a whine whine whin whiner the keys to any war.

    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 2:02 AM

    ---

    Let's see, here:

    "coward"
    "weasel"
    "seditious traitor"
    "whiner"

    but "...Paul Rieckhoff is a tremendous guy"

    Bovine!
    You found a perfect mate for your paranoia!
    Schizophrenic Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 2:02 AM

    Rieckhoff was arrested in 1998 for lewd conduct on a subway. He plead guilty and payed a 15 hundred dollar fine and did community service.

    Obama, I've come to expect corruption from all levels of politics and from all people. What I said about Walmart had nothing to do with trying to miss taxes. What I was saying about Walmart is that they take advantage of these small countries and their lax labor laws in order to make a few extra billion and keep their prices low enough to run other buisinesses out of town. But seriously, is that all you've got?

    Average American Patriot: You can be a coward / whiner / hippy and be an upstanding person. I just would not trust that kind of person to be president.

    DoD Announces Recruiting and Retention Numbers for FY 2006

    The Department of Defense announced today its recruiting and retention statistics for the active and Reserve components for fiscal 2006.

    Active Duty Recruiting Fiscal 2006. All services have met or exceeded their recruiting goals for fiscal 2006.

    http://www.defenselink.mil/releases/release.aspx?releaseid=10057


    And here I thought morale was dropping. Or the war is unpopular. Or something.

    There ARE Two Americas, and one of them is defending the other. Guess which one whines, demonstrates, claims to 'support the troops' but in fact undermines them and aides our enemies, and guess which one is putting their butts on the line?

    Okay, It is approaching or passed 100 commentator posts, so I am off to get soem shut-eye. Good night all of the patriots ... & cowards.

    Eileen Bachmann for president in 2008 !!!!!

    Obama: "The left are trying to make Bush look bad for political purposes."

    Obama, Obama, Obama: Bush has made himself look bad all by himself. He hasn't been helped one little bit by "the left".

    If anything, there is a natural tendency of many people such as yourself to support the president simply because he IS president, regardless of what he does, or has done. This is part of what we are fighting today.

    It is so interesting to read someone like yourself say we "want the troops out for no good reason", because that statement makes absolutely NO sense.

    - You don't think saving thousands of American lives is a 'good' reason?

    - You don't think saving many times more than that from life debilitating injuries is a 'good' reason?

    - You don't think saving an army that is literally close to it's breaking point a 'good' reason?

    - You don't think stopping our slide into possibly irreversable International debtitude is a 'good' reason?

    You stated a few weeks ago that you think "it's a good thing we went in there", but that statement makes no sense whatsoever either. Why in the world would any thinking person still believe that "It's a good thing we went in there"...at least with the benefit of hindsight?

    Finally Obama, what is your final vision of Iraq when we finally "finnish up", as you put it? How do you see an adequate 'finish' happening?....Especially with a military only approach? How do you see us imposing a solution on an entire disjointed population?...When the only thing they hate more than each other...is us? Do you REALLY see anything other than a Shia clergy dominated society in the end? Do you think we should stay there forever?....And if so, how do you think we could possibly sustain such an effort?

    OWUBFT spins, diverts!

    ---

    You can be a coward / whiner / hippy and be an upstanding person. I just would not trust that kind of person to be president.
    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 2:16 AM

    ----

    You forgot about "seditious traitor"
    already?

    "...I just would not trust that kind of person to be president..."

    Is Paul Rieckhoff running for president?
    He might as well be, since the swift boating and smearing is already being done.

    Paul Rieckhoff:
    "coward"
    "weasel"
    "seditious traitor"
    "whiner"
    "pervert"

    according to Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 2:16 AM

    An interesting and 'cowardly' thing always seems to happen whenever these kinds of debates erupt.

    The right wing chickenhawks always seem to revert to calling the other side absurd monikers such as 'cowards, whiners, traiters, defeatests, etc., etc.". It's as if they cannot sustain an argument without resortin to smear tactics.

    It never really works though!.....the ones doing the smearing are usually ones who have never served their country themselves, and would never seriously consider serving their country themselves...much like the ones at the top who created this mess.

    And so often the ones being labeled as 'cowards' and 'traitors' are the very ones who actually HAVE served their country honorably...It's amazing how often this pattern repeats itself!

    You would think that the chickenhawks would occasionally stop and think that maybe...just maybe...that the ones who HAVE actually served might naturally have gained just a little more insight than they have?

    way below average clinton c**k smoker, you can unwad your panties, now.

    BRING BACK JOHNNY$

    Average American Patriot: You can be a coward / whiner / hippy and be an upstanding person. I just would not trust that kind of person to be president.

    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 2:16 AM

    So, you cant be a hippie, but a C-student is totally cool. Gotcha, free thinkers cant be president, but C-Average Students can.

    And RK, Shut up, Bitch. You're not allowed to talk until you can come up with something along the lines of a coherent, fact-based argument against what I have said. You're avoiding reality, kid, better start opening your eyes. The right wing is ignorant, you're the poster boy.

    So, you cant be a hippie, but a C-student is totally cool. Gotcha, free thinkers cant be president, but C-Average Students can.

    And RK, Shut up, Bitch. You're not allowed to talk until you can come up with something along the lines of a coherent, fact-based argument against what I have said. You're avoiding reality, kid, better start opening your eyes. The right wing is ignorant, you're the poster boy.

    Posted by: Nick at May 23, 2007 4:26 AM


    Nick, because you're so enthralled with the facts...here's one you might find interesting.

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/columnist/benedetto/2005-06-10-benedetto_x.htm

    Cecilia. Im not sure if you've forgotten...but that election was 3 years ago...and you all stole it. And i already knew that he was a C student. My point wasnt that we CANT have a c-student in office (its sad thats the best we can offer some years), my point was that how on earth is it better to have a stubborn, self-contained c-student than a free-thinking hippie.

    was too busy getting the information on the episode to actually listen to anything that the weasel Rieckhoff was saying. Sorry. He is a coward if he appears on Countdown, we know.

    Posted by: Obama Watch Us Bicker Formerly in Technicolor at May 23, 2007 1:26 AM

    These brownshirts are disgusting. I'd like to beat the living fuck out out of these chickenhawk fascist goons.

    George Bush is a fucking liar. He never served.

    " You are just as Ronald Reagan said, you would rather live on your knees as appeasers than die on your feet as free men. "

    Ronald Reagan never served - he made propaganda films in CA during WWII. I guess he's a chickenshit. A big-time chickenshit.

    Robt Dole did serve in WWII, and in his book he jokes about recieving a purple heart for a superficial wound he himself inflicted. Not a big deal, but then 50 years later he joins the chorus of swift-boaters lambasting Kerry for the same thing. That's Republican integrity for you.

    Another Republican who saw action, but who retained his honor despite his party affilliation, is Chuck Hagel, who was in the thick of it in Vietnam. He's far left of Hillary and Obama on the war now

    Olbermann, as the voice of the radical left, should be angry about the democrats caving into a president they (and Olbermann) have described as

    irrelevant
    incompetant
    stuuuupid
    isolated
    a loser
    selfish
    stubborn
    on an island with Cee

    as they fund a war they have described as

    absurd
    lost
    evil
    immoral
    lining Haliburton's pockets
    lining Cheney's pockets
    killing innocents
    creating refugees
    creating terrorists
    based on lies
    Bush's war
    a waste of money
    a waste of lives
    vastly unpopular
    the reason the democrats now control congress.

    I would be angry too if I agreed to support the democrat party elite while they continue to use tactics like using a war as a political issue to insure future political success....

    Like is explained by this honest Machiavellian at HuffPo:

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/thomas-de-zengotita/house-democrats-cave-on-w_b_49093.html

    "Ok, there they all were this evening, looking Memorial Day in the eye, and sending Bush his war funding without timelines. A bill full of language authored by John Warner, as a matter of fact. But one that also included a rise in the minimum wage and hurricane relief. There they were: Pelosi, Hoyer, Obey, Emanuel.

    "Caving.

    "But look, these people aren't stupid. They know what they're doing. The real issue is does the anti-war progressive base know what it is doing? Is it focused on making sure that Democrats win the White House in '08 and keep control of both houses of Congress? Or is it focused on a genuinely radical anti-corporate, anti-imperial, anti-globalization long term agenda for which the fate of Democrats in '08 is just an incidental tactical issue?

    "Someday I'll sketch out what the strategy and tactics should be for the genuine radicals. But for those progressives who want to ensure a Democratic sweep in '08, here's the deal. Judo is all about falling backwards after pretending to shove forward. Judo is all about flipping the opponent by virtue of his own weight as he leans into the emptiness of your caving.

    "What House Democrats are trying to guarantee is this: the Iraq war belongs to Bush and the Republican Party now -- and so it must when the election of 2008 rolls around. That's what they want to guarantee above all else.

    "Cynical? Indifferent to the suffering of US troops and Iraqi civilians?

    "You bet.

    "Welcome to the political world of grown-ups who hold office and have institutional responsibility.

    "Myself, I'm Peter Pan..."

    ###
    So my conclusion is.....The democrats do not really care about the troops.....If they really did they would not have caved.....as I have been saying all along since the election season of 2006.

    cee

    "I'd tell you that the Democrats are talking a good game, but they're not even doing that. Everybody in Congress has to understand something: If they continue to fund this war, it's not just the President who owns it. They own it, too." Sgt. Liam Madden

    "There were a few tense moments, however, including an encounter involving Joshua Sparling, 25, who was on crutches and who said he was a corporal with the 82nd Airborne Division and lost his right leg below the knee in Ramadi, Iraq. Mr. Sparling spoke at a smaller rally held earlier in the day at the United States Navy Memorial, and voiced his support for the administration?s policies in Iraq. Later, as antiwar protesters passed where he and his group were standing, words were exchanged and one of the antiwar protestors spit at the ground near Mr. Sparling; he spit back." NYT 1/28/07

    "I think the Vietnamese are better off in Vietnam," George McGovern - NEWSWEEK

    "Lefties: Leave these pathetic drowning rats alone to stew in each other's juices. Get yourselves out in the street and fight this criminal administration in ways that really mean something, and that are noted by more than a handful of keyboard heroes!" Sir Loin of Beef

    "2. George Bush served in still one of the worlds most dangerous professions. That's more that we can say about willie clinton who dodged the draft and went to the USSR to protest."

    In 1986 George Bush told a Texas Newspaper: "I wasn't going to run off to Canada or shoot out my eardrum with a shotgun, so I decided to better myself by learning how to fly airplanes". Not a chance he was going to put himself on the front lines in the war his family fortune was feasting on. He "bettered himself" for a fraction of his oibligation, then got bored and nipped out to avoid a drug test.

    "Most dangerous profession"? Not if you don't get in a plane, you simpleton.

    cee is right.

    Washington is full of bloviating oportunists without an ounce of integrity. There are a handful of them worth consideration and support, however. The Democrats are weak, but the Republicans are overtly destructive and venal.

    This is why I avoid election"horse-race" coverage and instead focus on the issues.

    I decided to do some research on Paul Rieckhoff and found two opinion pieces that may be worth a read:


    Counterpunch on Operation (Un)Truth/Paul Rieckhoff

    A Trojan Jackass for the Anti-War Movement
    http://www.counterpunch.org/goff04022005.html


    Column: Ex-BRAC leader lends perspective to VA scandals
    http://www.norwichbulletin.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070513/COLUMNISTS11/705130314/1014/OPINION


    “I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.” Senator Russ Feingold 5/22/07

    ###
    Nick? Kokomo (?sp)? Professor Honeydew?
    Mike? Anyone?

    The Peanut Farmer in a "nutshell."

    Iran

    On taking office in 1977, Carter declared that advancing "human rights" was among his highest priorities. America's ally, the Shah of Iran, was one of his first targets, with Carter chastising him for his human rights record and withdrawing America's support.

    One of the charges was that the Shah had been torturing about 3,000 prisoners, many of them accused of being Soviet agents. Carter sent a clear message to the Islamic fundamentalists that America would not come to the Shah's aid. His anti-Shah speeches blared from public address systems in downtown Tehran.

    The irony, as noted by Steven Hayward of the American Enterprise Institute in his book, "The Real Jimmy Carter," is that the regime of Ayatollah Khomeini "executed more people in its first year in power than the Shah's SAVAK had allegedly killed in the previous 25 years." Khomeini's regime was a human rights nightmare.

    When Khomeini, a former Muslim exile in Paris, overthrew the Shah in 1979, he established the first modern Islamic regime, a role model for the Taliban and the jihadists to follow. And when the U.S. embassy was stormed that November and 52 American hostages were held for 444 days, America's lack of resolve was confirmed in the jihadist mind.

    The wreckage of Carter's foreign policy was seen in the Iranian desert, where a plan to rescue the hostages, a plan never formally presented to the Joint Chiefs, resulted in the loss of eight aircraft, five airmen and three Marines. The rest, as they say, is history.

    Hezbollah

    As we have noted, it was the Ayatollah Khomeini who introduced the idea of suicide bombers to the Palestine Liberation Organization and who paid $35,000 to PLO families who would offer up their children as human bombs to kill as many Israelis as possible.

    It was Khomeini who would give the world Hezbollah to make war on Israel and destroy the multicultural democracy that was Lebanon. And perhaps Jimmy has forgotten that Hezbollah, which he helped make possible, killed 241 U.S. Marines in their Beirut barracks in 1982.

    The Soviet Union, seeing us so willingly abandon a staunch ally, invaded Afghanistan, and it was the resistance to the Soviet invasion that helped give birth to the Taliban. The Iranian revolution led to the Iraq-Iran War that took a million lives and encouraged Hussein to invade Kuwait to strengthen his position.

    That led to Operation Desert Storm and bases in Saudi Arabia that fueled Islamist resentment, one of the reasons given by Osama bin Laden for striking at America, the Great Satan. Now we're about to face a nuclear Iran as we are embroiled in a war on terror.

    If we'd stuck by the Shah and his successors, the history of the last 25 years in the Middle East and here at home would have been very different. As Hayward observes, the fruits of Carter's Iran disaster are with us still, spawning the rise of radical Islam, terrorism, the Taliban and al-Qaida.

    North Korea

    When President Clinton first learned of the North Korean nuclear program in 1994, a surgical strike against its Yongbyong reactor might have sufficed to send Pyongyang a message that a nuclear North Korea was unacceptable.

    Instead, Clinton allowed Jimmy Carter to engage in some private foreign policy and jet off to the last Stalinist regime on earth to broker a deal whereby North Korea would promise to forgo a nuclear weapons program in exchange for a basket of goodies that included oil, fool and, amazingly, nuclear technology.

    Along the way, Carter praised North Korea's mass-murdering dictator as a "vigorous and intelligent man." And of North Korea itself, Carter said of this habitat for inhumanity: "I don't see they are an outlaw nation."

    Cold War

    Jimmy Carter also once challenged Ronald Reagan's "aggressive" and successful strategy for winning the Cold War. Perhaps he'd like to send one of his Habitat for Humanity crews to rebuild the Berlin Wall brick by tyrannical brick. The fact is that Jimmy Carter could not have done more to damage our national security had he been a hand-picked mole planted in the White House by the KGB.

    When Carter left office, the Soviet Union was on the march from Grenada to Afghanistan, control of the strategic Panama Canal had been given away, our military had planes that couldn't fly and ships that couldn't sail for lack of trained crews and spare parts, production of the B-1 strategic bomber had been canceled and our economy was in no shape to resist Soviet expansion.

    Jimmy Carter, the man who makes Neville Chamberlain look like Dirty Harry, made his remarks about President Bush while promoting his audiobook series of Bible lessons for children. Jimmy, thou shalt not bear false witness against your president and country. Haven't you done enough damage? If you want to see our worst ex-president, look in the mirror.

    Tomorrow: How Carter ran the world's greatest economy into the ground.


    Brought to you by Disneyland


    Nick? Kokomo (?sp)? Professor Honeydew?
    Mike? Anyone?

    Posted by: cee at May 23, 2007 10:42 AM


    Hell Yeah! I've been saying for years that Feingold should run for president - he is pat of an elite group - along with Dennis Kucinich, Chuck Hagel, and Ron Paul, who are both intelligent and principled.

    My Democratic senator is a particular pussy - he abstained from the vote.

    Cee, You quoted exactly what we say, so whats your point? Yeah, our leadership sucks, but there are extenuating circumstances that Ive already laid out to you once. So unless you said something what I said earlier, then Ill consider your post null and void. Hey, Bobby, I deal with these things, they're called Facts, not opinions. Maybe thats why we're screaming impeachment and you all are just a bunch of blind rats following your mouse king.

    Ooops, i forget that when debating with cee one needs to redundantly tag each post with a decisive historical quote. Here's mine:

    ""But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." Hermann Goering

    So Nick, am I to assume you agree with Senator Feingold and no democrat should vote for the supplemental funding bill?

    In other words....do not provide the funds for the war? (My request of the opposition all along)

    That dumb twat Monica Goodling just tried to take the fifth in a hearing in which her testimony has been granted full immunity.

    This Sunday-school lawyer is the type of person that this administration puts into crucial positions of our justice department - shows the degree of respect they extend to justice, doesn't it?


    ""But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." Hermann Goering

    I decided to do some research on Paul Rieckhoff and found two opinion pieces that may be worth a read:
    Posted by: Robert Cox at May 23, 2007 9:58 AM

    Thanks Robert, those were very good. Should you forward them to Olbermann, or let him be continually "duped"---I vote for "duped" ---its way more entertaining that way.

    Nice quote, Loin.....In reality, in the fallen world that human beings operate in....manipulation/demogogery/lies/stealth are resorted to.....It is the usual way.....FDR, Stalin and Churchill had to do it for the right reasons in WWII, and they were successful....to the benefit of you, me and the rest of the posters here today.

    I guess the argument lies on whether the good ends for the group being protected justify the means?

    cee

    “I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.” Senator Russ Feingold 5/22/07

    Cee, since you addressed me regarding Feingold, I ask you for about the tenth time: What is your point when you keep taunting me and others as to why the democrats are not doing what they should do?

    Is that your intention....to taunt?

    Because if you are not just taunting us, I just don't see what your purpose is?

    Russ Feingold is one fine, highly pricinpaled Senator who is on record as warning the Senate what a collosal mistake it would be to give an irresponsible president like George Bush the authority to invade Iraq. Most ignored him....including many Democrats....and we are where we are today as a direct result.

    So yes, Cee....Feingold IS right, and Feingold HAS been right all along....but unfortunately, having been right, and continuing to stand on principal in America today doesn't garner the admiration and repect that it should.

    As for relevant historical quotes....I like beef's a lot....to me, it has much to say about why America has gotten itself into the mess it is now in,.

    FDR, Stalin and Churchill had to do it for the right reasons in WWII, and they were successful....to the benefit of you, me and the rest of the posters here today.

    I guess the argument lies on whether the good ends for the group being protected justify the means?

    cee

    Certainly. And the "group being protected" by FDR were people living in or aspiring to democratic systems. One group definitely NOT being protected were war profiteers. There was not propaganda but instead open and relevant exchanges of information in the senate hearings chaired by Truman during the war, ensuring that corporate pofits were tightly limited.

    That's just a sad joke today.

    "But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." Hermann Goering


    “I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.” Senator Russ Feingold 5/22/07

    Am I as bored with Olbermann as Robert Cox is? Please let eddie or obama do the recaps...unless of course the master, Johnny $ is coming back...

    ...also, in regard to cee's previous post, I would like to ask him to back up his implication that FDR "attacked the peacemakers" during WWII. I am not disputing that his administration may have done this, but I'd be interested to see what he can come up with, and who may have been the target of such attacks.


    "But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." Hermann Goering


    “I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.” Senator Russ Feingold 5/22/07

    No, Mike....the taunt is but a tactic to move a discussion that remains "safe." Just like Olbermann's and Fineman's conversation last night on COUNTDOWN.....The political positioning....winners and losers....blah, blah, blah....it is a safe discussion...no consequences.....Confronting a sitting President over a policy one is heartfelt against, using ALL of the available tools to do so......a tougher discussion.

    I want resolution....yes or no.....in 100% or 0% support for the Iraq war....no safe conversations or temporary solutions....decisive action.

    Another example of "safe" is the name calling, use of ancillary issues and diversions that only confuse the important issue at hand.....the war. I said it before....people like Professor Honeydew can negatively describe Bush 1000 ways to Sunday but if Bush gets to do what he planned on doing...it means nothing. The conversation always goes that way....Bush is this, the war is that....but the action of the opposition is fleeting, "safe," nonconfrontational....impotent.

    Let's have at it already....Is not the issue of war...the life and death of thousands of human beings WORTH a political confrontation....even a Constitutional crisis?

    cee

    “I cannot support a bill that contains nothing more than toothless benchmarks and that allows the president to continue what may be the greatest foreign policy blunder in our nation’s history,” he said. “There has been a lot of tough talk from members of Congress about wanting to end this war, but it looks like the desire for political comfort won out over real action. Congress should have stood strong, acknowledged the will of the American people, and insisted on a bill requiring a real change of course in Iraq.” Senator Russ Feingold 5/22/07

    "people like Professor Honeydew can negatively describe Bush 1000 ways to Sunday but if Bush gets to do what he planned on doing...it means nothing. "

    I don't understand what you are saying? Are you suggesting that, for five years of fawning, sycophantic "oversight" by a Republican congress that Bush was unable to "get to do what he planned on doing"? That's a pretty slimy dodge, if that was your point.

    "Let's have at it already....Is not the issue of war...the life and death of thousands of human beings WORTH a political confrontation....even a Constitutional crisis?

    cee"

    Yes, cee, it is. I agree completely. Along these lines, can you cite any instance in which you, prior to the 2006 elections, in which you advocated to your Republican leadership that they allow the demorats to hold their repeatedly requested hearings regarding the war?

    A problem, Sir Loin of Milquetoast....you must forget I have consistently agreed with the President's policy even when WMD's were not found because the mission remained to achieve a stable Iraq that would not fall into Iran's or Al Queda's sole possesion (sycophantic [sic]...you can call it what you want.....I don't care)

    I would not support a Congressman or Senator who wanted troop withdrawl at this time. I will only concede to policy change (premature withdrawal) if the Iraqi government requests it or General Petreus recommends it.

    I do not like the Vietnamesque "death by a thousand pricks" approach of the opposition....It took over 10 years for Vietnam to be resolved (in devastating immoral defeat like I have said before) because of the same "safe" approach by the left in opposing the war. Having your cake and eating it too had a HUGE price then as it always does.

    And I REALLY do not like the war as an issue for an election that is over a year away....The 2008 power struggle is not a good reason to allow symbolic legislation be the solution to issues involving war.

    The ancillary issues of war profiteering, inteligence failures, etc. should be dealth with in their own right but do not reflect positively or negatively on the merits of supporting an ally in the global war on terrorism.

    cee

    "I'd tell you that the Democrats are talking a good game, but they're not even doing that. Everybody in Congress has to understand something: If they continue to fund this war, it's not just the President who owns it. They own it, too." Sgt. Liam Madden

    "There were a few tense moments, however, including an encounter involving Joshua Sparling, 25, who was on crutches and who said he was a corporal with the 82nd Airborne Division and lost his right leg below the knee in Ramadi, Iraq. Mr. Sparling spoke at a smaller rally held earlier in the day at the United States Navy Memorial, and voiced his support for the administration?s policies in Iraq. Later, as antiwar protesters passed where he and his group were standing, words were exchanged and one of the antiwar protestors spit at the ground near Mr. Sparling; he spit back." NYT 1/28/07

    "I think the Vietnamese are better off in Vietnam," George McGovern - NEWSWEEK

    "Lefties: Leave these pathetic drowning rats alone to stew in each other's juices. Get yourselves out in the street and fight this criminal administration in ways that really mean something, and that are noted by more than a handful of keyboard heroes!" Sir Loin of Beef

    Where will you be on June 3rd?

    June 3rd is coming!

    Are you ready?

    Cee, I hate to say that I agree with you about something...but I do on one important principal:

    - ANY member of Congress who is STILL sitting on the fence about the war after 5 years is a spineless self centered wimp...be they Republican or be they a Democrat.

    - Basing a stand on this war for political career considerations is beneath contempt. The stakes are so much more enormous than the individual careers of politicians that it is hard to imagine that some would actually whore themselves by being THAT selfish, but there is little doubt that many are...on BOTH sides of the isle.

    "I would not support a Congressman or Senator who wanted troop withdrawl at this time. I will only concede to policy change (premature withdrawal) if the Iraqi government requests it or General Petreus recommends it."

    The Iraqi government has not officially legislated in that regard, but the preponderance of the comments of individual officials in their government's key positions certainly indicate that this is their desire, while popular polls in Iraq clearly say "get out".

    What if the discusions regarding continued US presence, recently voted into existence by the Iraqi legislature, actually end with a resolution that we leave?

    What if Petreus recommends it and is replaced by Bush within a week, as has been the case over and over again across the history of Bush's sad campaign?

    Will you stick by your statement above? I suspect you will stick with your fetish/president whichever way he leads you.

    In reverse Loin.....Which active supreme commander in Iraq publicly recommended total withdrawal as the only option prior to their departure?

    IF Petreus reported publicly that he recommends withdrawl as the only option and Bush ignored this advice and even replaced him....I would call my Congressman and Senators and register my opinion that no funding should be approved for the Iraq operation.....I would also join you in protesting the war.

    The Iraqi timetable petition you are referring to has not been voted on formally to be binding and the elected executives in Iraq still request the US military support that is required as they struggle to fashion national unity. Their success or failure may indeed be a long time in coming but the alternative to an Iranian and/or Al Queda puppet can still be avoided.

    Polls in the US say 70% want "get out".....whatever that actually means in reality?......but it is still the wise system of representative governance that dictates the ultimate outcome and rightly so, because the wisdom of the mob is frequently the wrong choice.....especially when they are under severe hardship, fearful, selfish, uneducated, and or ill-informed (I am making no claim specifically to those polled now...I am speaking generally).

    SLOB:

    Give some context to your statement below:
    What if the discusions regarding continued US presence, RECENTLY VOTED INTO EXISTENCE by the Iraqi legislature, . . .

    Another cut and paste moment rather than paraphrasing.

    http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:QgUF377PQyYJ:www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi%3Ffile%3D/chronicle/archive/2007/05/11/MNG37PPB881.DTL%26type%3Dpolitics+iraqi+government+legislation+us+withdrawal&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us&client=firefox-a

    A majority of Iraq's parliament has signed a proposed bill that would require a timetable for the withdrawal of U.S. soldiers from Iraq and freeze current troop levels, a sign of a growing division between Iraqi legislators and the prime minister that mirrors the widening gulf between the Bush administration and its critics in Congress.

    The draft bill would create a timeline for a gradual departure, much like what some Democrats in the United States have demanded, and require the Iraqi government to secure parliament's approval before any further extensions of the U.N. mandate for foreign troops in Iraq, which expires at the end of 2007.

    "We haven't asked for the immediate withdrawal of multinational forces, we asked that we should build our security forces and make them qualified and at that point there would be a withdrawal," said Baha al-Araji, a parliamentarian allied with the anti-American Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, whose supporters drafted the bill. "But no one can accept the occupation of his country."

    In both Iraq and the United States, there is deepening frustration among lawmakers and the public over President Bush's troop buildup, a policy that has yet to prevent widespread killing in Iraq. At the same time, Bush and Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki are dispatching their emissaries in an urgent transatlantic gambit to shore up support.

    Iraq's national security adviser, Mowaffak al-Rubaie, was in Washington this week to ask Democratic members of Congress to have patience with the "surge," and to not abandon Iraq at such a precarious time. On Wednesday, Vice President Dick Cheney landed in Baghdad to press the government to act quickly on a host of divisive political issues the Bush administration deems necessary for long-term stability.

    On his second day in Iraq, Cheney spoke to U.S. soldiers at a base near Tikrit about the difficulties they face.

    "We are here, above all, because the terrorists who have declared war on America and other free nations have made Iraq the central front in that war," he said, according to a transcript of his remarks. "The United States, also, has made a decision: As the prime target of a global war against terror, we will stay on the offensive. We will not sit back and wait to be hit again."

    But as in the United States, Iraq's lawmakers are moving further away from the views of the government, particularly on the issue of American presence in Iraq. The draft bill is being championed by a 30-member bloc loyal to al-Sadr, but it has also gained support from some other Shiite, Sunni and Kurdish legislators.

    So far, at least 138 lawmakers have signed the proposed legislation, the slimmest possible majority in the 275-member parliament, according to Araji. Nassr al-Rubae, another al-Sadr loyalist, told the Associated Press that the draft bill had 144 signatures.

    Several legislators, including those loyal to al-Maliki, doubted the effort would succeed at a time when Iraqi troops still rely heavily on U.S. firepower.

    The most prominent political parties in Iraq, such as al-Maliki's Dawa party; the Shiite group known as the Supreme Council for the Islamic Revolution in Iraq; the Iraqi Islamic Party, a leading Sunni group; and prominent Kurdish factions appear to not support setting specific dates for withdrawal.

    And even if such dates were established, it is unclear whether that would compel the United States to obey them.

    Ali al-Adeeb, a Dawa lawmaker and an aide to al-Maliki, said any timetable for American withdrawal should be accompanied by a timetable for training and equipping the Iraqi security forces.

    "Pressures are increasing here in Iraq and also in the states for the withdrawal of the multinational forces ... and it seems that keeping these forces here indefinitely won't solve the problems in Iraq," he said. "But it should happen gradually so that Iraqi forces can handle the security tasks."

    There was also some disagreement over the terms of proposed timetable legislation. Kurdish lawmaker Mahmoud Othman told the Associated Press he agreed to back the measure on the condition it include an accompanying timeline for the buildup of Iraqi forces, but this was not included in the draft, which he called a "deception."

    Hassan al-Shimmari, a Shiite who leads the Fadhila party in parliament, also signed the petition and had similar concerns.

    "At the time being we can all see that it's not possible for the American troops to leave, and that withdrawing right now would lead to a disaster in Iraq, because the Iraqi security forces are still very weak, and they are still controlled by their sectarian and factional loyalties," Shimmari said.

    It looks like a body of one of our missing men has been found in a river and one site is reported the other two bodies have also been discovered. The only confirmation from the military is of a body being recovered that is being id'd.

    What's "June 3", Cox? A putsch? A pogrom? A Crawfordburg Rally?

    "ATLANTA - A former Coca-Cola secretary convicted of conspiring to steal trade secrets from the world's largest beverage maker was sentenced Wednesday to 8 years in federal prison.

    Joya Williams, 42, had faced up to 10 years in prison on the single conspiracy charge in a failed scheme to sell the materials to rival Pepsi for at least $1.5 million. She was convicted Feb. 2 following a jury trial in U.S. District Court in Atlanta, where The Coca-Cola Co. is based..."

    She would've been better off outing a CIA agent. Apparently, that is legal in this country...

    but it is still the wise system of representative governance that dictates the ultimate outcome and rightly so, because the wisdom of the mob is frequently the wrong choice.....especially when they are under severe hardship, fearful, selfish, uneducated, and or ill-informed (I am making no claim specifically to those polled now...I am speaking generally).

    Posted by: cee at May 23, 2007 1:46 PM


    Do you see that you are arguing in a vortex? We create the chaos - clearly seen in the sequence of disastrous decisions made through Bremer in his disarticulation of the civic infrastructure of Iraq that had survived the "liberation". Now those who studiously created this situation blame the battered electorate of our new colony for not being resolute in its own governance.

    The Iraqi government lacks the support of its own people because no one there believes that the American occupiers ever intend to leave. The spurious argument of the right against "timeliines" is that the insurgents will just "wait us out" - but in fact, its clear that the democrats of that country are just "waiting us out", not wanting to throw their political wills into the service of a foreign occupier.

    Had we left early- as Jay Garner was working toward - leaving the reconstruction in the hand of Iraqis, then we might be now seeing a viable society and government in that land. If we leave now there will probably be a continuation of the chaos, but we will also see the power of self-determination finally begin to take root.

    ...but self-determination for Iraqis is not really what Bush's war is about, is t?

    "She would've been better off outing a CIA agent. Apparently, that is legal in this country..."

    Hy, idiot, if you want to complain about a CIA emploee being "outed" your complaint should go directly to none other than said employee's husband, Mr. Joseph Wilson:


    "If anyone is responsible for Plame’s outing, it is Wilson himself. Not content to express his opinion within the diplomatic, military or intelligence communities after his inconclusive report was dismissed, he went public. His scathing, op-ed for the New York Times was an overt political act that put him in the spotlight he craved, but also called attention to those around him. He knew that as a controversial figure he would come under intense professional and personal scrutiny. It now seems clear that Wilson was willing to sacrifice his wife’s career to gain the notoriety he sought."

    SLOB,

    Don't you think it is plausible that there is an undisclosed time line for obvious reasons? If you carefully review the President's speech in January (as I have), you might see that.

    "I have made it clear to the Prime Minister and Iraq's other leaders that America's commitment is not open-ended. If the Iraqi government does not follow through on its promises, it will lose the support of the American people — and it will lose the support of the Iraqi people. Now is the time to act."

    Just my opinion.

    hank is a moron. Who are you quoting? Karl Rove? Rush Limbaugh?

    Hank,

    As much as I appreciate your giving me the opinion of a homosexual prostitute, perhaps you should find someone with a little bit more respectablity...

    Jeff Gannon is just a call-boy in a reporter's hat, son...

    Hank's preferred method of joining in a debate is to yell, "hey idiot"....nice!

    He fits right in with this administration, who have effectively been yelling, "hey idiots' to Congress and the American people for 5 years, while being wrong themselves most of the time.

    WASHINGTON - One in four younger U.S. Muslims said in a poll that suicide bombings to defend their religion are acceptable at least in some circumstances, though most Muslim Americans overwhelmingly reject the tactic and are critical of Islamic extremism and al-Qaida.

    A staggering statistic, to say the least.

    Hank's preferred method of joining in a debate is to yell, "hey idiot"....nice!
    Posted by: Mike at May 23, 2007 2:42 PM

    No criticism of your buddy, nicky? Shocker....

    The problem is that rk cannot imagine a circumstance under which he would die defending Christianity...or his country...or probably his family, if he has one...

    Blindrat: I know you have vision problems but read the article you posted again. The Coca-Cola employee was trying to SELL trade secrets of the company to Pepsi. That was the crime. Hell, I'm not even sure WHAT point you're trying to make there. As I recall, someone was convicted re Plame, although not on the charges you apparently wanted them sent up on. Furthermore, to my knowledge, no one profited financially from the incident. There's a big difference between industrial espionage and working as an agent for the CIA in case you didn't know. And apparently you don't.

    Brandon,

    If you value the service of a soft drink industry over the service of our intelligence agents, I can see what is wrong with you Republicans, son...

    And, as is obvious with Bush/Cheney, political power equals money, child...

    OK, this is pretty funny -- Ren & Stimpy's Creator Takes Shot at Keith Olbermann:

    Animator John Kricfalusi, the creator of Ren & Stimpy, put a blog post up on Wednesday dealing with over-the-top stereotypes in 1930s cartoons, and basically telling people to lighten up about their hyper-sensitivity. Included in the blog entry was this paragraph:

    ***

    Animation is just great for stereotypes. In real life, stereotypes create themselves and are then caricatured in stand up comedy, rap videos and live action media. Then liberal white women and Keith Olberman cry about it.

    http://johnkstuff.blogspot.com/2007/05/oswald-going-to-blazes-cartoons-make.html

    ***

    Wonder if Keith will create a new category of "Worst Cartoon Person in the World" after this shot across the bow?


    You're right. I'll shut up.

    re: John's post

    This shows the problem with neocons. They ignore scientists when it comes to evolution and global warming; however, if a random cartoonist has an opinion, they are all over it...

    SLOB,

    Don't you think it is plausible that there is an undisclosed time line for obvious reasons? If you carefully review the President's speech in January (as I have), you might see that.

    "I have made it clear to the Prime Minister and Iraq's other leaders that America's commitment is not open-ended. If the Iraqi government does not follow through on its promises, it will lose the support of the American people — and it will lose the support of the Iraqi people. Now is the time to act."

    Just my opinion.

    Posted by: Sharon at May 23, 2007 2:33 PM


    Isee your point - it is a vacuous and dangerously credulous one, but I see it.

    "
    Do you really believe that this inveterate liar has any "undisclosed timelines" in mind? Is that why we have spent over 100 billion dollars building a gigantic embassy/fortress/Ministry of Love in Bagdhad, and spent uncounted billions in building a dozen or immense permanent military bases in Iraq?

    BLINDRAT

    SHOULDN'T YOU BE WORKING RIGHT NOW?

    WHO KNOWS?

    blindrat,

    Was hank really quoting Jeff Gannon/Jim Guckert? HA HA

    Here are the responses of the loons when I posted about who should be blamed for the Valerie Plame outing:

    SLOB says:

    "hank is a moron."

    blindrat says:

    "perhaps you should find someone with a little bit more respectablity"

    Mike says:

    "Hank's preferred method of joining in a debate is to yell, "hey idiot"

    I kept searching in vain for an actual substantive counterargument to the point made about who actually bears responsibility for the "outing" but alas, none was forthcoming from these three shining lights of mediocrity.

    Of course, these three will be the first to complain that we criticize Olbermann for matters having nothing to do with his substantive arguments, but when substantive arguments are made that they don't like, they employ this precise methodology.

    Oh, you want a source that you libs are more simpatico with? Here you go, straight from lib ground zero, The Washington Post:

    "It now appears that the person most responsible for the end of Ms. Plame's CIA career is Mr. Wilson. Mr. Wilson chose to go public with an explosive charge, claiming -- falsely, as it turned out -- that he had debunked reports of Iraqi uranium-shopping in Niger and that his report had circulated to senior administration officials. He ought to have expected that both those officials and journalists such as Mr. Novak would ask why a retired ambassador would have been sent on such a mission and that the answer would point to his wife. He diverted responsibility from himself and his false charges by claiming that President Bush's closest aides had engaged in an illegal conspiracy. It's unfortunate that so many people took him seriously"

    The problem is that rk cannot imagine a circumstance under which he would die defending Christianity...or his country...or probably his family, if he has one...

    Posted by: blindrat at May 23, 2007 2:55 PM

    I take it you fall in the 1 out of 4.

    blindrat --

    Were we deciding the fate of the world here, I might give more of a damn about the sky-is-falling posts. But picturing a cartoon chihuahua with its eyes popping out yelling "Keith! You iddootttt!" is a lot more entertaining.

    But if you really think the world suddenly hates us now because Chimpy McBushitlerburton is in the White House, check out the actions of these Europeans when the Democrats controlled both the White House and Congress in 1967:

    http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=OTZkMjI1MjJmMmVlNjYyZDU0MzhkZmVhMjAxOGI0NmU=

    John, assrat discounts info I post from The Pentagon website, if that tells you anything about his "respectable" sourses while he posts articles from websites off the chart left/un heard of.

    royalking --

    I know, and I'm not expecting much by posting the link. I just want to see if he decides to defend the "Hate America" European youths or Robert F. Kennedy, or if he avoids this conundrum entirely as well.

    From Olbermann's NEWSHOLE.....

    "You, the men and women elected with the simplest of directions - Stop The War - have traded your strength, your bargaining position, and the uniform support of those who elected you… for a handful of magic beans."

    Ah....classic Keith Olbermann indignation.....let us all prepare for a Special Comment.

    http://thenewshole.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/05/23/201521.aspx

    cee

    "I'd tell you that the Democrats are talking a good game, but they're not even doing that. Everybody in Congress has to understand something: If they continue to fund this war, it's not just the President who owns it. They own it, too." Sgt. Liam Madden

    "There were a few tense moments, however, including an encounter involving Joshua Sparling, 25, who was on crutches and who said he was a corporal with the 82nd Airborne Division and lost his right leg below the knee in Ramadi, Iraq. Mr. Sparling spoke at a smaller rally held earlier in the day at the United States Navy Memorial, and voiced his support for the administration?s policies in Iraq. Later, as antiwar protesters passed where he and his group were standing, words were exchanged and one of the antiwar protestors spit at the ground near Mr. Sparling; he spit back." NYT 1/28/07

    "I think the Vietnamese are better off in Vietnam," George McGovern - NEWSWEEK

    "Lefties: Leave these pathetic drowning rats alone to stew in each other's juices. Get yourselves out in the street and fight this criminal administration in ways that really mean something, and that are noted by more than a handful of keyboard heroes!" Sir Loin of Beef

    He avoids everything entirely well, especially facts.

    Ah....classic Keith Olbermann indignation.....let us all prepare for a Special Comment.

    http://thenewshole.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2007/05/23/201521.aspx

    cee

    cee,

    What's your point? If that Olbermann quote you just posted is something he actually said, he is conforming precisely to the degree of consistency and integrity that you have been demanding all day long of the left. Can't you give credit when your own words - rare ones in that they actually make sense - come out of an ideological opponent's mouth?

    Loin, I was commenting on the style, not the content, of the coming Special Comment.

    I have always expressed that Olbermann is a demagogue. The line, "handful of magic beans" is typical of his attempt at literary flare that has always come off stunted and over-rehearsed....I expect no different from him tonight with all of the usual camera angle changes, dramatic pauses and facial tics.

    I always go back to his claim of being Edward R. Murrow. Murrow was a SERIOUS and ethical man...He was a journalist. He invited McCarthy on to his show and allowed him rebuttal for goodness sake....Keith Olbermann is a propagandist for his ideology and nothing he reports about or editorializes about should ever be taken seriously by either those who agree with his politics or by those who are at the polar opposite of his ideology. He cannot be trusted.

    Oh, and I am sure this Special Comment will follow either a tongue-n-cheek report concerning Paris Hilton or American Idol.

    Good night and good luck.

    cee

    SLOB,

    It is a completely vacuous and incredible idea that information is being withheld to prevent terrorists' awareness of time lines? I doubt Bush had time lines in mind early on; he probably thought he didn't need them. But your point about the collapse of the infrastructure is well-taken. Bush knows that. He put Petreus in charge of a last ditch effort to salvage what can be salvaged, hoping for a miracle on the one hand, and preparing for the inevitable on the other. He should have gotten rid of Rumsfeld much sooner.

    To Brandon: Since you already posted on Ms. Tur's online job search, can you comment on the rest of her video's to inform others of her "connections via Olberduche" seems the folks there are a little confused and not aware of her "leg up" on them (them being the competition).

    example comment on one of her video pieces:
    I do not think that light was a good choice at all... You seem to do a lot of news pieces?... Are you a journalism student? I work at a local CBS affiliate in the Promotions dept. and I think you do a very nice job! .... GL!

    Ms. Tur is learning well from the master, she watches him mislead his viewers every night...Great Thanks for your public service Brandon...

    Sharon, you said it well with your suggestion that Bush may be "hoping for a miracle on the one hand, and preparing for the inevitable on the other"....interesting.

    If the odds are really that long even in his own mind, how can sacrificing the hundreds, and maybe thousands of additional lives be justifiable in the pursuit of a miracle?

    John, thank you from the bottom of my heart for the reference. This is something I missed about RR. RR's points and answers are very much in keeping with the insight we learned from "Reagan In his Own Hand".

    John, I wonder how many here will take the time to link and read this. The questions from representative students from around the world then and the answers by representatives of the major political factions in the US virtually mirror the situation we are in now that resonates today as if time stood still.

    "MARKS: ....also considerable intimidation. --you accuse us being inconsistent....accuse North Vietnam of not holding free elections, ....condemn the South Vietnam government that President Johnson is supporting for holding elections that are equally as farcical ...."

    RFK: "KENNEDY: O.K., I understand that. I understand. I would say that there, as I've said before, I think THAT THERE WERE MISTAKES THAT WERE MADE over the period of the last 10 years. There were MISTAKES in which I was involved - excuse me."

    "GRAZIANI:....what the Americans are doing in Vietnam....what right ...By going there, they have breached the U.N. Charter, the U.S. Constitution, and the Geneva Agreements. What can you say about that?

    REAGAN: Well, I don't think they have breached any of those agreements....

    RR then went on to give the details that are the foundation of his answer.

    Like all great men he addresses universal truths about man and his history while aptly applying it to the specific circumstances of the day. Just a few quotes from Ronaldus Magnificus to illustrate my point:

    "unlike a family quarrel, it doesn't take two to make a war. It only takes one, unless the other one is prepared to surrender at the first hint of force."

    And in his closing statement:

    REAGAN: ....I believe the highest aspiration of man should be individual freedom and the development of the--of the individual....I think you should weigh everything that is proposed to you, everything in the line of government and law and economic theory, everything of that kind and weigh it on this one scale--that it should at all times not offer you some kind of sanctuary or security in exchange for your right to fly as high and as far as your own strength and ability will take you as an individual, with no ceiling put on that effort. Plenty of room for a floor underneath so that no one in this world should live in degradation, beneath that floor, but you reserve the right for yourself to be free.

    Grammie

    The bumper sticker on Cee's car says:

    DON'T question authority

    (When there's an (R) in the Whitehouse)

    >Sharon, you said it well with your suggestion that Bush may be "hoping for a miracle on the one hand, and preparing for the inevitable on the other"....interesting.

    Is this the same as wishing in one hand and shitting in the other?

    I think it is...

    Issue #1: I forget. I am still reeling over Keith Olbermann agreeing with Bill O' Rielly and calling him "buddy".

    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    I made a mistake. Keith Olbermann said "Billy", not "buddy". I am also not sure if Keith Olbermann agreed with Bill O' Rielly that Iran should be blown to smiterines.

    He should have gotten rid of Rumsfeld much sooner.
    Posted by: Sharon at May 23, 2007 6:05 PM

    I thought Rummy 'resigned.'

    Lets just pull out of Iraq and let the Sunni, Shiite, and Kurds fight it out, causing millions of deaths and further de-stabalize the region. It worked so well when we left Vietnam. Who cares that 2 million south Vietnamese died? It only took another twenty years for them to normalize.

    This way we can just blame more deaths on Bush. It should work for the next election, but we may have to blame him for something else for the election after that. I hope this global warming thing pans out.

    >The Democrats voted for this war. That's a fact. The Democrats are now in charge. So where's the accountability they promised? Where are the timetables? You have no answers for that though do you?

    and on that, GOOD NIGHT to you! No Name!
    Posted by: Brandon at May 22, 2007 11:51 PM

    This argument is so ignorant on so many levels.

    If it wasn't for Bush, the Democrats wouldn't have to worry about how to clean up the mess he made, now would they?

    Class dismissed, but Brandon, you're staying after for some 'extra credit.'

    >Who cares that 2 million south Vietnamese died?

    Would that have happened if we never went there in the first place to combat the Eeeeevil Communists?

    Yeah, you really care about vietnamese and iraqis (when it's politically expedient to do so.)

    You should be ashamed, but apparently you weren't born with that gene (and a few others).

    In the last six or seven months since I ventured into this 'Brave New World" of the internet I have been repeatedly accused of virtually every moral depredation known to man. However, those sins are peccadillo's compared to the proven beyond all reasonable doubt verdict by political opponents that I am personally responsible for the untold suffering and death of innumerable American military and innocent civilians around the world.

    I believe that barring some world altering event to us such as 9/11 that ultimately the overall opposing view will prevail. Once your predominant view is in place at what point do you accept responsibility for any subsequent events if there are any. I have no doubt that there will be some.

    What will be your position then?

    Will you piously absolve yourself in the mode of Chicken Blogger that GWB was the beginning of the world and all its evils? And how long do you think that that will make you an innocent bystander?

    Or, will you accept the blame that you have so cavalierly laid at the feet of others for your own responsibility and blame?

    Personally, I think that most of us make our decisions based on our best deliberations and decisions of what is best both for ourselves and others. Obviously many do not share that view.

    Grammie

    Yeah right on. Lets compound a known mistake with an even worse one. It is always a good argument to say that "we shouldn't have been there in the first place". That makes it even more okay to knowingly let millions die. We don't need to clean up our own messes. We need to leave that to someone else. It is the way we do things.

    If the odds are really that long even in his own mind, how can sacrificing the hundreds, and maybe thousands of additional lives be justifiable in the pursuit of a miracle?


    Posted by: Mike at May 23, 2007 6:20 PM


    You forgot to throw in your "maimed" and "permanently disabled" talking point.

    The commies weren't evil. Oppression, lack of religious freedom, or freedom of speech, or forced inturnment, indoctrination, and lack of personal sovereignty is awesome. It's just collectivism at work. "It takes a Village" you know. Yep no threat at all. And what's the big hub bub about Islam, they are just proselytizing in their own way. No big woop. Just convert or die. I have no spine so I'll convert. It sounds awesome, plus I get a free robe thingy and a goat.

    Chicken Blogger, to tweak a line from "The Manchurian Candidate" exactly WHEN DID THE WORLD BEGIN for you?

    Give us all the benefit of your omniscience and we can start the debate at that point. Do we start with Imperialism, Democracy. Stalinism, Fascism or eons earlier?

    Of course events flow from one to the other through thousands of years of recorded history. Just tell us where they start for you and on what basis you begin to count the mass deaths of innocent humans to define your beginning and moral superiority.

    Personally, I view Stalin as more heinous than Hitler because he killed more innocents and had a more profound effect on our modern world. You may have a different view.

    Pick your starting point and I will go on from there for the purposes of this argument.

    Grammie

    "The line, "handful of magic beans" is typical of his attempt at literary flare that has always come off stunted and over-rehearsed..."


    Well, cee, its no more goofy than ".....In reality, in the fallen world that human beings operate in....". You need to take a much closer look at yourself using the same lens you use to judge others.

    Loon, you are one of the best. You condense so much into so few words.

    You have been imitated from the other side with disastrous results. It put me in mind of the cheap suits Kruschev and his minions wore.

    Grammie

    Mike,

    When I heard about the soldiers being captured, my heart sank. I began to question whether a bunch of kidnappings with videos was worth the objectives of to use the controversial phrase "staying the course." Then I followed the events since and how relentless our military has been in finding those men. When the two were captured last year, they were already dead. The horrendous treatment the men's bodies received was indescribable. The bodies were found within a couple of days. THis capture is different. The terrorists have been hounded day and night. Men lost an average of 10-12 pounds from their search efforts in the brutal heat. I don't think they expected that kind of resolve. For some reason, you question the authenticity of CJ, a soldier who commented here some weeks ago. He has that kind of resolve. He is legitimate. His last name is Grisham. He e-mailed me a clip from a radio show he was on. That is where I found out about the website he established for fallen soldiers called theyhavenames. Somewhere along the way I posted a link to a story about a petition presented to Congress opposing withdrawal and signed by a a couple thousand plus members of the military who were either currently serving or had served. I don't remember the breakdown of the numbers.

    or had served in Iraq

    He should have gotten rid of Rumsfeld much sooner.
    Posted by: Sharon at May 23, 2007 6:05 PM

    I thought Rummy 'resigned.'
    Posted by: at May 23, 2007 7:06 PM

    Yeah...sure he did.
    Ha !

    Sharon I don't think you are giving me enough credit when you say I "questioned the authenticity of CJ".

    While I did say that CJ could be anybody in a later post....but that comment was made only within the context of my saying I take EVERYTHING I read with a grain of salt, but that is not the same as assuming something is a lie. In other words, I took CJ's word as being who he said he was just like I take anybody else's word, unless they have given me legitimate reason to believe otherwise.

    I debated CJ one night about Al Qaeda in Iraq while never doubting he was who he said he was. But I also never doubted that the other veteran (forgot the name he used) was who he said he was as well. yet some on here were calling him a 'liar'....with no evidence.

    I also respect CJ enormously for being who he says he is, (as you have confirmed he is). Not only that, I HOPE every soldier who has to fight in the God forsaken war believes as strongly in what they are doing as well.

    No one has any more respect than I do for the troops, and what they are being asked to do for us....and what they will do for each other.

    If you have been on this blog long enough, you will probably remember that I have personally been called a 'liar' myself regarding my own status as a veteran. It's hard to know how to reply to something like that, especially when it's difficult for me personally to understand why anyone would get on a blog board and lie?....But I know it happens.

    "especially when it's difficult for me personally to understand why anyone would get on a blog board and lie?....But I know it happens."

    Posted by: Mike at May 24, 2007 12:07 AM

    I wonder the same thing myself.....

    RK, will you not respond to me anymore? Are you running away like Rummy did when we won the chance to hold him accountable? Lord knows you've taken a few pages outta Bush's book. I wish he would take after you for once.

    Hmmm. Has Cecelia decided to start leaving anonymous comments now? I've addressed The Anonymous Ones "points" above. They want answers now on this war and there are no easy solutions, despite the pablum they were fed and eagerly ate by the likes of Olbermann and the Democratic party. Now the Dems have shown their true colors. What else will they default on? You people are so quick to point your finger at the Republicans but you don't exactly have a stable full of prize winners yourself. And remember, the Republicans were backed by the Democrats every single step of the way on this war and every aspect of it up to and including today. Deal with it sucker.

    Posted by: Brandon at May 22, 2007 11:45 PM


    No, Einstein, I've never left an anonymous post and I am a Republican.

    Loin....

    ".....In reality, in the fallen world that human beings operate in...." reflects my world-view of the base evil in all people (and I inculde myself ) and their (my) ultimate inability to rise above it effectively on their (my) own...I harldly see a comparison to "magic beans," unless you are taking a shot at my beliefs, once again.

    Also....Mr. Olbermann claims to be a journalist in the mold of Murrow (I am kind of sick of repeating my argument here)....and Mr. Olbermann is on TV....I am not a journalist given 60 minutes during primetime.....I simply put my thoughts on this blog.....Mr. Olbermann is dishonestly using a venue for his own ideology and I think he should be held accountable for it.

    And Chicken Blogger at May 23, 2007 6:59 PM...if I never questioned authority why do I even post here....I do question the authority of Keith Olbermann as NBC contines to present him as a responsible journalist called to present authoritative information and comment.....I question the judgement of the democrat party which holds great power over me through their elective offices and press conferences. I guess since I agree with President Bush that automatically makes me a blind follower and not someone who has researched and compared his policy to that of his loyal opposition?


    I've never left an anonymous post and I am a Republican.
    Posted by: Cecelia at May 24, 2007 2:44 AM

    A Republican who quotes Hamlet, then has to tell everyone here she's quoting Hamlet...trust me, this person will NEVER post anonymously, rest assured.

    You need to take a much closer look at yourself using the same lens you use to judge others.
    Posted by: Sir Loin of Beef at May 23, 2007 8:57 PM

    The comments write themselves....really.

    >And Chicken Blogger at May 23, 2007 6:59 PM...if I never questioned authority why do I even post here....I do question the authority of Keith Olbermann as NBC contines to present him as a responsible journalist called to present authoritative information and comment.....I question the judgement of the democrat party which holds great power over me through their elective offices and press conferences. I guess since I agree with President Bush that automatically makes me a blind follower and not someone who has researched and compared his policy to that of his loyal opposition?

    Posted by: cee at May 24, 2007 9:16 AM

    You actually believe that commenting on a site that blogs negatively about Keith Olbermann is 'questioning authority.'

    And the democrats hold power over you with their press conferences?

    Isn't that just a hoot.

    Someone watches waaaaaaay too much TV.

    nobody cares/booby/average clinton c**k smoker, looks like you have aligned yourself with the quiter, rosie and mickey and nickey mouse with the "certain death" theory. 3000 out of 1.2 million, I guess you could consider that "certain death" or "death warrants" if you're a moron.

    RoyalKing, we've already gone over this, asshole. As soon as you can rebut ANYTHING I said in there except what I've already said I didnt mean to, or realize I've said, THEN you're allowed to post again. Bend over, Bitch.

    And Nobody cares? What about the 71% of the population that cares? What about the millions of people that voted the democrats into congress in (false) hopes that they would do something. Who doesnt care? Bush and his gang of warlords. Oh, and obviously your worthless ass

    Republican who quotes Hamlet, then has to tell everyone here she's quoting Hamlet...trust me, this person will NEVER post anonymously, rest assured.

    You need to take a much closer look at yourself using the same lens you use to judge others.
    Posted by: Sir Loin of Beef at May 23, 2007 8:57 PM

    The comments write themselves....really.

    Posted by: Jerry Fall...well at May 24, 2007 2:03 PM


    Actually, I said "not to Hamlet" in reply to anonyloon's line "brevity is the soul of tit" because Hamlet had mommy-issues. But you're fairly correct otherwise.. :D

    ^
    The comments write themselves....really.

    Dream on Twat, forget the spin, just flat out lie, GOOD GIRL. Respond Twat, you simply can not help yourself. I love it. You are the best Twat on this board, don' t ever change, don't ever leave. You are so entertaining! Don't forget to give us some Hamlet quotes, because we all know you'll respond. GREAT THANKS :D

    Posted by: Jerry Fall...well at June 2, 2007 5:31 PM

    Still threatened by Shakespeare quotes...
    Next time I'll quote King Lear. You're the perfect Oswald.
    Posted by: Cecelia at June 2, 2007 10:49 PM

    So sorry for the delay Twat, but I knew you would respond, it's been so long since I cared, I had to search for your response. (I have to post it here because the Rosie thread is closed).
    Great Thanks for more Shakespeare quotes. I edited your lie, but what the heck. Like I said before, any moron with a GED can quote Hamlet, etc. But the best is the moron that has to let everyone else know she's quoting Hamlet. The Twat's Threat Level: VERY INSECURE. :D

    So sorry for the delay Twat, but I knew you would respond, it's been so long since I cared, I had to search for your response.
    Posted by: Jerry Fall...well at June 7, 2007 4:57 PM


    And a brilliant response it is, Einstein!

    It's a hoot to see you go scout out posts (One from 5/26!) in order to chide me about pointless responses...

    FYI-- you wouldn't be the first person to obsessively "care" about me here... :D

    Oh joy, oh rapture, sssshhhheeeess bbaaaaaack! I missed you so, what, no Hamlet, twat.


    oops I forgot:

    :D (happy twat)